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Question: Hi! Can someone explain the difference between 'siya'

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Author Photo by: Hazel
Jun 09 2020, 8:33pm CST ~ 4 weeks ago. 
Question: Hi! Can someone explain the difference between 'siya' and 'kanya', please? Why can't they be used interchangeably?
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Author Photo Bituingmaykinang
Jun 09 2020, 9:27pm CST ~ 4 weeks ago. 
Siya is him/her. Kanya is his/hers.
 
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Author Photo blueshell Badge: Native Tagalog Speaker
Jun 12 2020, 11:52am CST ~ 3 weeks, 5 days ago. 
@Hazel - "Siya" is also translated as "He/She", especially if you will use it in front of a sentence.
Example: Siya yung kinukuwento ko. --> He/She is the one I'm talking about.
 
I hope this too would help you in some way.
 
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Author Photo hamilee Badge: Native Tagalog Speaker
Jun 12 2020, 8:33pm CST ~ 3 weeks, 4 days ago. 
@Hazel
Siya is He/She.
Siya is also him/her
Kanya is hers/his.
 
Look at the examples below on how we use them.
 
Siya ang may-ari ng singsing.
He/She is the owner of the ring.
 
Sa kanya iyun.
That's hers/his.
 
Siya iyun. Ang bida sa pelikula.
That's her/him. The protagonist in the movie.
 
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Author Photo Ignatius
Jun 13 2020, 12:54am CST ~ 3 weeks, 4 days ago. 
As noted above, "siya" is a him/her.
Formal grammar usage means it's for a him/ her, not an "it".
 
I haven't been in the 'pines for over 30 years, and when my cousins use "siya" for an inanimate object, I get pissed. I was wondering if there was a decline in Filipino grammar use. My cousin says "Pula siya", referring to a red truck. The correct way to describe it would be"Pula yung truck".
 
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Author Photo hamilee Badge: Native Tagalog Speaker
Jun 13 2020, 9:47am CST ~ 3 weeks, 4 days ago. 
@Ignatius
You have a very good observation. I think it started in the 90’s when the new generation then was using “siya” as a pronoun for things and animals which is grammatically wrong. I agree it is really irritating! Probably because there are so many dialects in the Philippines that somehow people don’t really put emphasis on how to use Tagalog correctly. (On the contrary, Filipinos are very conscious to use correct grammar and pronunciation in English.)
 
Anyway, what I notice lately is the use of “Si” which is an article(?) for humans.
Like,
 
Si Carlos ay pumunta sa Mall. - Carlos went to the Mall.
The "si" is correctly used in this sentence referring to Carlos (person).
 
However, I often hear them say,
"Si Mall hindi siya pinapasok kasi wala siyang mask." Wrong because Mall is not a person to use the article "si". It should be,
"Hindi siya pinapasok sa Mall kasi wala siyang mask." Correct. This means,
"He was not all allowed to enter the Mall because he did not have (was not wearing) a mask."
 
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Author Photo primesgenato
Jun 13 2020, 10:23pm CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@hamilee
 
I'm not familiar with the construction of your last sentence labelled Correct. Can you pls elaborate on that sentence, i.e. "Hindi siya pinapasok sa Mall".
 
I thought it's "Hindi siya pumapasok sa Mall"? Or maybe "Hindi niya pinapasok ang Mall"?
 
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Author Photo Ignatius
Jun 14 2020, 5:03am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@primesgenato The first sentence is correct : he was not allowed to enter the mall.
The second one is awkward. It has a different context. I take it to mean, "he is not working at the mall" or "he doesn't work at the mall'. In this usage, it's not about entering the mall, but going to the mall as a place of work.
The last one is also awkward. It means, "he is not entering the mall (because of some condition)". This sentence structure will not be used by fluent speakers.
 
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Author Photo primesgenato
Jun 14 2020, 5:38am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@Ignatius
 
So to say the opposite, it's "Pinapasok siya sa mall", meaning he was allowed to enter the mall???
 
I thought "pasukin" means " to enter something", focusing on the object being entered? At least that's what I understood from studying the example sentences of "pasukin".
www.tagalog.com/word s/pasukin.php
 
How come "pinapasok siya" doesn't mean "entering him"? I'm getting quite confused now about the focus of "pasukin" haha.
 
Yes, I see what you mean about your other point, that "pumasok" can also have another meaning of "to work".
 
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Author Photo primesgenato
Jun 14 2020, 6:22am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
LOL I got it now folks. There's another verb "papasukin" that's homonymous to "pasukin".
 
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Author Photo jkos Badge: AdminBadge: SupporterBadge: VIP Supporter
Jun 14 2020, 7:52am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@primesgenato
This is going to be a recurring difficulty to be aware of...
 
Root+in verbs can have the same word conjugated (though different aspect) as pa+Root+in verbs if the root begins with a P.
 
There are some other tricky forms that can look like more than one verb type...ex: napa+Root and na+Root may look alike. Ex: napapasok = napa+pasok or na+pa+pasok?
 
To make things worse, many times in casual text people will conjugate an i+Root verb in the past and present tense and leave out the “i” making it unclear (without context) whether it is actually an i+Root verb or a Root+in verb.
 
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Author Photo primesgenato
Jun 14 2020, 8:11am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@jkos
 
Yep thx. Took me a while to realize that "tinext" and "tetext" were actually from "itext".
 
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Author Photo hamilee Badge: Native Tagalog Speaker
Jun 14 2020, 9:13am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@primesgenato
I think in the English language, it uses only prefixes and suffixes. In the Tagalog dialect, you also include affixes in the middle of the root word in different ways plus the prefixes and suffixes. Can you imagine how many words with different meanings you can come up with using only one root word?
 
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Author Photo Bituingmaykinang
Jun 14 2020, 11:18am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
I believe the use of siya and si for inanimate things and animals isn't used to mean "it", but the personification of these.
 
I don't think these are recent (90s and later) phenomenon. My mom tends to do this personification more than I do. Lol
 
One thing in casual Tagalog that you will see nowadays, and is a recent phenomenon is the use of "po" when using the "less polite" pronouns. Example: "Sino ka po"
 
There's also the "contraction" of some commonly used phrases like "Anyare" for "anong nangyari" and "ansabi" for "anong sinabi".
 
There are many things that can confuse learners as regards to casual speech because casual Tagalog and Tagalog slangs evolve way too fast. Even I, as a millennial, have to catch up.
 
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Author Photo Ignatius
Jun 14 2020, 11:23am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@primesgenato
Your understanding and usage is correct, 1st sentence.
 
Pasukin = to enter, the act of entering (pasok means enter). You got it right.
 
Pinapasok siya = Pina(the allowance of) + pasok (the act of entering) + siya (the person doing the act). So in short, "he (or she) was allowed to enter".
 
Pinasok siya is literally saying, "he was entered". Now a person cannot enter another person (generally; keep it clean 😄).
Only an entity can enter a person, so 'pinasok siya" implies a person was entered by another entity, as in a possession. This is why you normally would not say "pinasok siya".
As in most languages, it's a the context.
 
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Author Photo Ignatius
Jun 14 2020, 11:36am CST ~ 3 weeks, 3 days ago. 
@Bituingmaykinang And that is why it is proper Filipino grammar. I'm saying people nowadays use it, well anything goes in conversational use, but it's not proper. Inanimate objects & animals are it, so to personify them is awkward.
In English you say 'the bed is soft", or "it is soft". You don't say "he is soft", because the bed is not a "he".
The exception which I would say is acceptable is when you are referring to a pet, who's been given a name. So you can say about your dog, "mataba siya" = he is fat, because in this context, there is an established personal bond between you and your pet.
 
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