Kinausap natin si Atty. Gilbert Andres ng Center for International Law tungkol sa pagbasura ng ICC appeals chamber sa apela ng Philippine government na itigil na ang ICC investigation sa drug killings sa ilalim ni former President Rodrigo Duterte. Kaugnay nito, sinabi ni Sen. Bato dela Rosa, dating PNP chief ni Duterte, na di raw sya “bothered” sa imbestigasyon.

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... May mga pahayag kanina sa Sen. Bato de la Rosa, siya ang PNP chief, early during the Duterte administration, sabi niya sa panayam niya sa mga reporters sa Senate kanina, hanapin niyo ako nasa Pilipinas ako. I'm within the territorial jurisdiction of the Philippines. Kung mahanap nila ako then the next step ay arrestohin ako. Tingnan naman natin kung ma-arrestoh nila ako. So aware naman siya na hindi muna siya lalabas ng bansa.

... Mukhang may intuitive understanding na he was one of those primary responsible for the war on drugs ng Duterte administration. Because in fact he was the one issued sa isang memorandum circular 2016-01 if I'm not mistaken.

On Oplan double barrel. And it was in fact the current Sen. Bato de la Rosa who actually issued that. So naiintindihan niya ang kanyang responsibility Christian."

So nasa kung ma-arrestoh na at mapunta sa Hague, may personal jurisdiction na ang ICC. From then on talagang uuusad ang actual trial.

Q1. Pagganon ba excuse ang Presidente at pwedeng ituro ang mga implementors, underlings?

... He was making pronouncements publicly. And you know when the President makes a pronouncement that's actually official policy because he's no less than the President. So it can reach as high as the President.

So everyone who was responsible for implementing that state policy are the ones who should be indicted and that includes President Rodrigo Duterte.

Q1. Paano ang mga amuyong, mga kaalyado na talagang gina-justify kahit ang mga pang-aabuso ng time na yan? Kasama ba sa consideration yan, pati ang mga nagsasalita sa media?

Actually kung sino nag-implement ng policy, yan ang pinaka-question, yan ang pinaka-factual determination. In fact, that will be the point of this investigation, who's responsible for that state policy on EJ case in the war on drugs.

Speaking of investigation, hindi ba maging one-sided investigation kung hindi nga nag-cooperate ang Philippine government? Kasi diba sa mga nanonood, I hope you could get the dilemma, pwede siyang sabihin na chicken and egg.

So ayaw mag-cooperate ng State Party, dati tayong State Party sa Rome Statute. E paano makalap ng credible evidence? Sabi niyo pwede namang gamitin ang other sources, may online.

Baka naman i-argue let's say ng Philippine government at eventually kung saka-sakali man, may indict sabihin. E one-sided yan kasi hindi nga nag-cooperate ang government namin tapos meron kayong kaso sa amin.

Actually Christian, in fact it works both ways. Kung may evidence that will actually point that they're not criminally responsible, in fact dapat mag-cooperate ang Philippines.

Kasi it's in fact the duty of the prosecutor when there's already an indictment to present both pieces of evidence. The evidence that will convict and the evidence that will actually excuse criminal responsibility. That's actually the ethical duty of the prosecutor.

So this is even an argument for the Philippine government to cooperate. If really there's evidence to show that no less than President Duterte is not criminally responsible, why not present that evidence? Otherwise, di talagang evidence lang to really show criminal responsibility ang makikita.

Okay. Ito nga pala, for instance, nag-investigate na dito sa Pilipinas. Wala naman nakuha. Ano ba sinasabi niyo ng mga likely sources of information as part of the investigation?

Oo. It can even be states. It can be CSOs. It can be organizations. It can be the victims themselves or other resource persons. So marami pong mga pwedeng sources of evidence that the ICC prosecutor can actually look for.

And this very broad powers of the ICC prosecutor is founded on Article 54 of the ICC Rome Statute. Very expansive siya. In fact, I'm even presenting the theoretical possibility if the Marcos administration is really serious on what it's saying that it respects human rights, it can even enter into an operation agreement with the office of the prosecutor.

Napaka-optimistic niyo.

Challenge. Challenge to the Marcos administration.

Di ba optimism niyo?

Mayroon mag-vote.

Ito nga pala.

In circumstances.

I remember may announcement before sa President Marcos na they would stop all communication with the ICC. Ano ba ito? Parang help us understand this. Ayaw mag-cooperate pero sumasagot. Anong ibig sabihin?

May appeal. Technically, disordinary na nanonood at nakikinig. Baka iniisip. Di ba pag ayaw mag-cooperate, talagang dead ma. E dito sumasagot tayo, nag-appeal. Help us make sense of that.

Oo nga Christian. It's very interesting. In fact, if you look at the appeals decision, mukhang that was even considered by the majority.

The fact that the Philippines made a request for deferral is actually a recognition by the Philippines that the ICC has jurisdiction. Mukhang it was considered by the majority opinion.

E nga precisely. Di ba parang ano yan? Yun yung implication nun. Tama ba?

In fact, oo. Yun yung naging implication Christian. Which is really very interesting.

And nabasa ko snippets of it. It's actually 77 pages. So that's the most interesting point na nakita ko dun. So and I think it's just good that the Philippine government is cooperating.

Kasi sinasabing nila committee of nations, mutual respect. So that's actually good that it's cooperating in that sense. And I hope tuloy-tuloy na nila yung cooperation maski sa investigation.

Okay. Ito naman mag-what if discussion tayo. What if for some reason, talagang bumilis yung investigation dito sa Pilipinas, yung mga high level implementers,

architects, so-called architects ng drug war na yan, biglang pinapanagot ng current administration gamit yung ating Philippine justice system.

Could that actually stop the process at the ICC? Para sabihin, oo, dapat hindi na gumana yung sinasabing yung complementarity principle kasi meron na kami ginagawa.

E di ba court of last resort kayo?

Okay. You raise a very interesting point. In fact, theoretically, yes, it's a possibility.

But it will really take a lot of honest to goodness political will on the part of the Marcos Jr. administration.

So let's see. In fact, it's also a challenge. Talagang gusto nilang pakita that the justice system is working here,

then they should really show facts that they're investigating crimes against humanity against President Duterte and all of those responsible for the war on drugs.

So it's a standing challenge to the Marcos Jr. administration.

Kapala yung binabanggit niyo kanina yung mga pronouncements si former President Rodrigo Duterte about the drug war.

Sabi niyo, ordinarily kasi pag sinabi ng Presidente, policy na yan. Pero dito very unusual kasi yung character ni President Duterte.

May mga times mukhang seryoso, yun pala hindi. Pwede ba niyan sabihin?

Nagyo-joke lang ako. Hindi ko naman sinabing pagpapatayin niyan. That was a figure of speech. Tapos ang argument nila before.

Anong masama pag sinabi mong don't, if you ruin my country or something, I will kill you. Anong masama ron? I mean can that be an excuse?

Actually, President Duterte cannot make the excuse because the peculiar fact about it is that he is a lawyer. He's not an admission.

Admission because of statements, admission because of silence. So he actually made those statements not in a joking manner.

He was actually very serious about it and he knows that. Those are really admissions.