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... So basically kasi na pumasok si VP Sara Duterte ng 2022 hindi pa sa sarili niya ang budget na yan. Ang ginagamit pa ang budget na na-approbahan noong previous year. So ang sinasabi niyo dun sa budget na yan walang item whatsoever regarding confidential funds, tama po ba?"

... At ako nakakasiguro ako wala pang hiningi ng budget at wala na kalaang budget para sa confidential funds ng Office of the Vice President."

... Ang pinag-uusapan appropriation, kung walang nakalagay ng budget walang appropriation. So talagang hindi po pwede maglipat ng pera sa isang item kung walang appropriation. So there is really no item confidential funds in the Office of the Vice President.

Mayroon man pero walang appropriation, zero. At pangalawa Christian, ito po ang standard items, lines sa isang budget. Kasi every year paulit-ulit lang yan, paulit-ulit ang items.

So walang appropriation, nalagyan ng corresponding amount. E dito inaamin nila zero ang appropriation. Pangalawa Christian, ang sinasabi ni Sec. Lucas Bersamin, the transfer is because there is, babasahin ko lang, according to Sec. Lucas Bersamin...

... when she was re-elected then, needed funds for her new programs, I underscore that Christian, for her new programs for the remaining period of 2022.

But Christian also says, in the Supreme Court decision, the funding of projects, activities, and programs that were not covered by any appropriation in the General Appropriations Act is void for being in violation, is unconstitutional being in violation of Section 25, Paragraph 5, Article 6 of the 1987 Constitution.

So doon po sa decision, maliwanag ang sinabi ni Justice Bersamin na hindi po pwedeng punduhan ang project na walang appropriation, non-existent. Pero nung sinasabi niya ngayon, kaya daw sila naglipat ng pera to fund new projects.

So dobrang nakikita. Walang budget ang item na sinasabi nila.

So sa kanila nilang galing. Sila rin ang nagbigay ng informasyon. Marami nagtatanong po nito. Kasi kung may violation ng Constitution, ano exactly ang dapat mangyari after?

May mga nagtatanong po rito, is that an impeachable offense? Is that technical malversation? Ano po ba ang sagot noon?

Yung impeachable offense, yung congress. Impeachment is a political process. Although nasa batas po, nasa Sanigang Batas, magtabirin natin that's a political process. So an offense is impeachable if Congress says so.

Q. What is the revenue? A. What is the revenue? I am suggesting, Christian, na unang-una liwanagin natin na yung confidential and intelligence funds ay dapat i-appropriate lamang doon sa mga ahensya na siyang nag-gather ng intelligence funds.

Uritin ko lang, kung ikaw ay isang ahensya na nag-gather ng intelligence information, whether civilian o military, you are entitled to, you should be given confidential and intelligence funds because you need it for your work.

Halimbawa Christian, yung mga nasa armed forces, kailangan nila ang confidential and intelligence funds because by the very nature of their work, kailangan nila maghanap ng information.

Ganoon din po sa NBI, Philippine National Police. Because they're involved in law and order, they need confidential funds.

So I repeat, make it simple, those who are doing intelligence gathering should be given intelligence funds. Those who are not involved in gathering information should coordinate with this agency at doon sila maggawa ng intelligence gathering. So that's one safeguard.

Q1. Pero yung fact na naglipat ng pondo ang Office of the President sa isang ahensya o opisina na wala namang ganoon appropriation sa existing budget, ano po tawag doon?

Violation of the Constitution. Labak po sa salikang madas.

Kasi parang common understanding ng mga tao dyan, that can be construed as technical malversation. Tama po ba?

Hindi po. Hindi po technical malversation. Kasi ang kapangyarihan ng mag-appropriate ay nasa Kongreso. Ang technical malversation kung yung nakalaan ng pondo for a specific purpose gagamitin mo para sa ibang purpose.

Ngayon, dito hindi ganoon nangyari. May authority, they have the claim na mayroon silang kapangyarihan na maglipat ng pondo from one item in the Office of the President to the other item in the Office of the Vice President. Walang technical malversation.

Parang ano, sorry pakiulit ka. Kasi parang ganoon din yung dating sa akin. Nalipat mo sa isang purpose. Di ba ganoon din yan?

Oo. Hindi po. Because nilipus ka bilang sa isang purpose. Yan po ay kasama sa kapangyarihan to fix the budget and appropriation of the national government. But it is for a specific purpose.

Let's say the funds were transferred for the purpose of building schools. Ngayon ginamit mo para sa biyahe. Yan po ay bawal at may technical malversation because you use the funds appropriated for a purpose other than what was authorized.

But ito, the authority was, there was authority to transfer only that the authority is not consistent with the Constitution.

Okay. Naintindihan ko po. Pero yung source naman ng fund itself, kasi nakalagak po ito sa Office of the President, ano ba dapat nature ng pondo na yan to be able to augment another office's budget? Dapat ba savings po yan?

Yes. Sa lingkong bata, savings. There must be to augment and use the savings for augmentation. Because huwag natin kalimutan na ang kapangyarihan para mag-appropriate ay nasa Kongreso.

Pero ngayon, kung ang kapangyarihan na ito ay gagawin ng Pangulo o ng Chief Justice, e bawal po yan dahil hihina ang Kongreso at maging powerful po ang Pangulo kung may kapangyarihan siyang baliwalaan ang appropriation na ginawa ng Kongreso.

Okay. So in this case, buta binanggit nyo yan. Kasi I was supposed to ask that. Paano kung pindalampas yung mga ganitong galawan, ganitong kalakaran, what will happen?

So yung sinasabi niya, basically mas lalakas ang power ng Presidente, pababawasan ang power of the purse ng Kongreso. Ang tanong ko po ito Senator, yung next naman. So what should be done next? Dahil inamin ng OP, inamin din ng OVP. What should be done next?

Well, sa COA po, yung Commission on Audit, should not pass in audit this expense and therefore require reimbursement to the national coffers. Dahilan pwedeng kung sa sangayon ang COA, kasabihin nila ito po hindi sangayon sa Sanigang Batas, dapat isoli sa National Treasury yung perang nagastos.

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