00:55.8
Nangyari nga yung October 7 attack.
00:59.7
At the same time, sa bahagi naman ng mga Palestinians,
01:03.9
andyan din yung need nila for security based on a very basic premise, yung kanilang freedom.
01:12.3
Kasi occupied nga yung nakitirang territory nila.
01:16.0
Una, nawala na yung malaking bahagi nung natayuin state of Israel.
01:20.3
Pero itong Israel pa rin na nagpaprovide ng security sa East Jerusalem.
01:25.8
Sa West Bank at saka sa Gaza, napaka-restricted ng movements.
01:31.3
Tapos ang daming displacement na nangyari.
01:33.6
So, talagang walang-wala rin silang nararamdaman ng security.
01:37.8
So, kung hahanapin natin ngayon, paano ba magkaroon ng security ang state ng Israel?
01:44.2
At saka security, hindi lang yung Hamas kasi nakikita natin,
01:48.5
finish frame yung gera, Israel-Hamas.
01:51.6
Pero actually, mga Palestinians ang pinakamahal.
01:55.8
Mga malaking tinamaan nitong gera na ito.
02:02.2
So, ang kailangan talagang mag-evolve dito is yung security na mag-coexist sila on fair and equal terms.
02:12.4
Kasi ngayon, napaka-unequal ng relationship.
02:15.6
Hindi lang unequal pagdating sa military strength.
02:18.6
Unequal talaga sa lahat ng bagay in terms of yung control, basic control.
02:25.8
Unequal dun sa buhay ng mga tao.
02:28.8
Talagang napaka-restricted ng buhay ng mga Palestinians sa existing order.
02:37.3
Hanggang ngayon, nakikita natin, maski sa West Bank na hindi naman dapat kasama sa gera,
02:42.2
tuloy-tuloy pa rin yung pag-displace, pag-forcible,
02:47.7
na paglikas para maitayo yung mga Israeli settlement.
02:55.8
So, yun yung kailangan natin hanapan ng solusyon.
02:58.7
Tingin ko yun yung hinahanap din ng ibang mga nagme-mediate dito na iba't ibang mga bansa,
03:04.2
yung tinatawag ng the morning after.
03:06.9
What do you do the morning after, diba?
03:09.5
Pero in the meantime, napaka-basic bilang isang peace builder is yung panawagan nga na ceasefire.
03:17.0
Kasi masyado ng malaki yung cost sa buhay ng mga tao ang nangyari.
03:24.1
So, as a peace builder, you can only...
03:25.8
You can only talk politics or effectively, even yung release ng hostages,
03:30.8
mas effective mo yan magawa kung magtigil putukan tapos mag-usap pa paano mangyayari.
03:38.5
Hindi yung talagang, ano na lang, ituloy-tuloy ito.
03:43.9
At the risk of killing your own hostages, diba?
03:48.6
Okay. So, incidentally, diba, there was a first resolution calling for a humanitarian ceasefire.
03:55.8
Coming from the UN.
03:57.4
Anong tingin niya rin sa pag-abstain ng Philippine government?
04:00.3
Ang excuse... Ay, sorry. Sorry, nadulas ako.
04:03.5
Ang reason na ginamit nila was... Ano yan? Honest mistake, sorry.
04:06.6
Wala siyang intention na makasaraw or whatever.
04:09.5
Ang reason na ginamit ng Philippine government, nung ating ambassador doon was,
04:15.7
they were looking for a clear condemnation naman doon sa October 7 attack ng Hamas.
04:20.6
Parang wala daw silang problema rin sa humanitarian ceasefire.
04:23.7
Pero sana raw, nakalagay.
04:25.8
Yung in clear terms, yung pag-condena din doon sa Hamas attacks.
04:30.1
What do you think po?
04:31.9
Parang ano na lang yan eh, gymnastics sa lingwahe.
04:35.7
Kasi nakalagay naman doon sa resolution, we condemn all terrorist attacks,
04:40.4
we condemn yung indiscriminate and indiscriminate bombardment.
04:45.6
Lahat yan. So, hindi minensyo ng Israel, hindi minensyo ng Hamas.
04:50.3
So, papas, diba? Ganyan naman sa isang compromise document eh.
04:55.8
Parang sinasabi nila, hindi tama yung nangyari.
05:00.0
Ngayon, ang argument nga nung iba doon sa debate,
05:04.1
kung gusto mong i-mention yung Hamas, i-mention mo din yung Israel.
05:07.0
So, parang ang pinaka-compromise mo dyan.
05:09.6
Hindi mo na lang isusulat either Israel or Hamas,
05:13.4
pero kundem mo yung mga nangyayaring action.
05:16.7
So, parang napaka-unfortunate nun kasi,
05:19.4
ang ASEAN naglabas na ng statement na nanawagan ng ceasefire.
05:24.3
Eh, member tayo ng ASEAN bago nagkaroon ng UN,
05:28.0
nagkaroon ng boto sa UN General Assembly.
05:35.1
Pero, yun, hindi pa rin, dineside pa rin mag-abstain.
05:41.0
Pero ang maganda nitong huli, yung bagong UNGA resolution,
05:45.8
nag-ano na tayo? Nag-conquer na tayo.
05:49.6
Itong UN resolution na huli, itong nakaraan araw lang,
05:54.3
Nagsasabi na, um, occupy, occupying yung, ah, territories.
06:01.1
Kasi, na-alarm na nga yung mga tao rin, lalo yung sumingyari sa West Bank, ano.
06:05.7
Ito yung isang bahagi, nung, na, na, kabahagi ng Palestinian state.
06:11.5
Pero, nasa lalim siya ng Palestinian authority.
06:14.0
Yung Gaza, nasa ilalim ng Hamas, na, ah, na, na bahagi, na nakahiwalay sila.
06:20.5
Ah, talagang patuloy yung, ano eh.
06:24.3
Ang displacement.
06:25.3
Sinasabi dun sa resolution, it's an obstacle to peace,
06:28.9
na gawin nga yung ganong klaseng mga, ah, mga further, further,
06:36.2
ah, parang, ano eh, agresyon dun sa, ano, sa, ah, sa, sa tao.
06:43.1
Sa mga tao, sa mga Palestinians in particular.
06:45.4
So, nagsign na tayo dun.
06:47.4
Nag-conquer tayo dito sa huling UNGA resolution.
06:51.1
And as usual, ang, ah, nag-against,
06:55.7
Hungary, sino ba ba?
06:58.7
Ito ba nag-Canada?
07:00.7
Tapos yung iba nag-abstain.
07:02.7
So, I think, nung nag-abstain, nung, ah, nag-abstain tayo the first time,
07:07.3
it's because iniingatan natin yung relationship natin sa US.
07:11.5
Pero ngayon, ah, ah, buti na lang, ah, mas naging, ah,
07:16.5
mas informed na yung, medyo mas naging independent na tayo doon sa boto natin.
07:22.5
Kasi mahirap talaga i-depend eh.
07:23.9
Although malaki yung impact to, no?
07:25.9
Kasi yung illegal settlements, that's a very thorny and, ah, thorny issue yan, eh.
07:30.9
Diba? So, medyo iba nga nag-wulat dahil bumoto dyan, ah, in favor yung Pilipinas.
07:36.9
Ito po, gawin natin mas once pa yung discussion, no?
07:38.9
Kasi nga, yung mga nadidinig din ako, mga nag-observe dito, no?
07:42.9
Yung, if you want to play the blame game, parang nagiging fix sa isang point in history, yung start nila eh.
07:52.9
Parang you get what I mean, no?
07:53.7
Parang, kunwari, ang comment nila, eh, kasaralan ng Hamasyan kasi umatakas sila October 7, diba?
07:59.7
Kung doon magsisimula yung starting point ng discussion, mukhang malinaw.
08:03.7
Pero pagpag-uusapan naman, let's say, yung ano, yung, ah, 1948, 1947 to 1948, pwedeng meron ding ibang arguments regarding that, no?
08:14.7
Dito, pag-uusapan po muna natin, no?
08:16.7
Binabanggit nyo kasi yung, yung ill-treatment dito sa mga Palestino dun sa occupied territory.
08:22.7
Bakit ba humantong sa ganon na, sabi nga ng iba, parang second or third class citizens yung, yung treatment dun sa mga Palestino?
08:30.7
Ang concept kasi talaga ng Israel is to, ano eh, yun nga, yung pagtatayo ng Israel as a Jewish state, kasi yun yung ideology nila eh.
08:44.7
In Zionist movement.
08:45.7
As part, hmm, oo.
08:46.7
Tapos, yung, pag, ang, kaya bakit sila nagkaka, ah, nagmamobilize?
08:51.7
Nagmamobilize ng settlers nila na pumasok sa Palestinian area.
08:56.7
Nagpunta ako, nagpunta ako dyan nung nakarang taon eh, dun sa West Bank.
09:00.7
At nakita ko talaga, ah, dun sa hillside, ah, isang malaking, ano na, ah, malaking area naging Israeli settlement na may kalsada, may tubig, lahat.
09:13.7
Eh, nasa loob ng West Bank ito.
09:16.7
At ang nangyayari, yung mga fields nila, kung saan sila nag-grace ng mga hayop nila eh, nababawasan ng nababawasan, hindi sila basta makapasok.
09:26.7
Tapos, ah, hindi ka na nga kailangan bumalik pa sa 1948.
09:30.7
Itong taon lang na to, ilang Palestinians, mga bata, teenager, ang pinatay.
09:36.7
For the slightest reason, baril kagad ang, ang, ano, of course marami din nahuli, hinuhuli.
09:45.7
Itong huling, ah, end of Ramadan, ah, dun sa Al-Asqa Mosque, which is the holiest places for the Muslims in Jerusalem, no?
09:55.7
Ang security niyan, ah, Israel, mga Israelis, nung gusto nilang pauwiin na yung mga tao, binaril nila yung stained glass windows dun sa, ah, dun sa parang yung sa kung saan yung, ano, diba, yung sa taas nitong mosque na to.
10:13.7
Para ma, yung tao, umuwi na.
10:15.7
Pero si si Ryan may isang cultural, religious place for your, ano, to enforce yung gusto mong mangyari for, for security.
10:23.7
So, it's not even, ah, it's been going on.
10:27.7
And most recently, under, ah, Prime Minister, yung Netanyahu, talagang, kasi nga si, si, yung, yung Pangulo, yung namamuno sa kanila ngayon, talagang, sinasabi, right wing siya nga na.
10:44.7
Talagang nag-i-intensify yung situation.
10:47.7
Kaya, kaya gan, ano, ah, siguro at that point, no?
10:52.7
Pero sabihin na natin, maski mag-umpisa ka sa October 7, ang 1,200 Israelis, ang laki, grabe, ang laking number, unprecedented, ang pinatay.
11:04.7
So, okay, galit ka at saka tapos may hostages ka pa.
11:08.7
Pero, after October 7, sobra-sobra na rin.
11:12.7
Kaya nga, yung public opinion, ah, even in the United States, yung survey nila, recently na linabas, 68%, hindi na nagsusupport dito sa continued, ah, continued attacks ng Israel at gusto na rin magkaroon ng C-square.
11:29.7
Sa iba't ibang bahagi ng mundo, maski sa, sa Europe, ah, kung saan, yung ibang governments ay in favor pa rin of Israel, yung sa, sa UK, for, for example.
11:41.7
Kaya magkakaroon nga ng votes sa Parliament, eh, kung mananawagan na ng C-square o hindi.
11:46.7
Yung mga tao mismo, nakikita nila, excessive na yung naging response, hindi na talaga proportional.
11:53.7
Doon sa origin, kung mas sabihin mo na October 7 ang origin itong problema na ito, hindi na siya proportional doon sa nangyari noong October 7.
12:04.7
Pag ganyan ba, ah, ano ba yung proportionate response based doon sa nasasulat, no?
12:10.7
Ano ba yung proportionate response ng isang Estado pag inatake of that scale, like what happened noong, ah, October 7?
12:18.7
Ano yung, ano yung limits ng right to defend itself?
12:22.7
Ray, actually, yung, kasi ang, ah, dito, asymmetric to, eh, ang laki lang, ang mas malakas dihamak yung, ah, yung Israel, diba?
12:31.7
Tapos baligtarin mo, halimbawa, isipin yung sitwasyon natin sa West Philippine Sea.
12:37.7
Inatake natin ng isang Chinese na, kunwari lang, ah, ah, ah, isang, ah, Chinese vessel on our EEZ.
12:49.7
O on the territory, contested territory, pero, ah, kiniklaim natin.
12:54.7
Tapos, isipin ba na, eh, ang, ano yung rights ng China to defend what it claims is its territory?
13:03.7
Tama ba na pupulbusin niya?
13:05.7
Pupulbusin niya halimbawa.
13:06.7
Ano bang pinakamalapit na isle na, ano doon, ah, yung…
13:11.7
Pwede yung Zambales.
13:14.7
O kaya, sa kabil sa bandang baba, Palawan.
13:16.7
Tama ba na pupulbusin niya ito?
13:18.7
Dahil inatake mo yung, yung boat nila.
13:21.7
So, yung question ng proportionality, eh.
13:24.7
Ang, ang, ang, kung talagang, ang primary concern mo, may hostage taking na nangyari, ang primary concern mo ay inego, inegotiate yung release ng hostages.
13:35.7
Siyempre gagamit ka, maaari kang gumamit ng carrot and stick, di ba?
13:39.7
Pero kung ganun ang focus mo, to release the hostage at saka, ah, mag, ah, i-vindicate yung mga pinatay sa site mo, doon, pwede ka naman dumaan din sa, hindi itong, ano eh, ah, sabihin mo na gusto nilang eliminate ang Hamas.
14:01.7
Physically eliminate.
14:03.7
Kasi may political elimination, may physical elimination, hindi naman…
14:07.7
Sa kanila parang pareho eh, yun ang target, di ba? Wipe them out of the face of the earth, di ba? Yung Hamas.
14:12.7
Pero maibig kasi yun eh, ah, lalo kang nagpapaanak ng maraming Hamas na nangyayari sa kanila eh, di ba?
14:20.7
Maaaring mawala yung Hamas, pero mawawala ba yung radicalism after nangyari ito?
14:27.7
Actually, both sides yan eh, di ba? Tama po ba?
14:30.7
Kunwari, yung mga naulila ng mga batang Israelis.
14:33.7
Siyempre, mas ma-steal yung resolve nila talagang, yan ang kalaban namin. Sila yung demonyo.
14:38.7
On the other side, ganun din. Yung mga namatayan, di ba? Talagang demonyo naman yung kabilang side.
14:43.7
Pameto, gawin natin mas ano pa eh, mas complicated kasi ito rin yung mga, ano eh, samotsaring parte ng konteksto dito.
14:51.7
Ang argument naman ng mga Israelis, tsaka ng mga sumusuporto rin, sinasabi nila,
14:55.7
it's not easy as it seems when it comes to discussions about proportionate response.
15:00.7
Dahil sinasabi nila,
15:01.7
yung Hamas, ginagamit na humanship.
15:03.7
Yung mga Palestinians.
15:05.7
Tapos yung mga military, ano, talitong facilities, nakatago daw sa hospital compound, sa mosque mismo, sa mga bahay-bahay.
15:15.7
I mean, yung konteksto na yun, ano naman ang proportionate response sa ganun konteksto?
15:20.7
Okay, 36 hospitals na yung inatak.
15:24.7
Apparently, itong sa Al-Shifa, which is parang one of the bigger hospitals, at saka,
15:31.7
kung saan na nga tumakbo lahat ng mga tao for medical at saka treatment at saka refuge after attacking.
15:38.7
No, sorry, 18 of 36 hospitals in attack na, so halos kalahati.
15:45.7
Sa, ano yan, sa north, no, mostly.
15:49.7
Tapos itong Al-Shifa, kung saan tumakbo yung mga tao, ito na yung huli.
15:53.7
And apparently, meron nakitang mga barel, meron nakitang, ito sa latest report, di ba, na nakikita natin ngayon.
16:01.7
May tunnel. Pero yung tunnel, dun sa across the street na bahay ng isang hamas na several floors.
16:10.7
So hindi pa nila nakikita kung yung tunnel na yan nakakoneg.
16:14.7
Okay, sabihin natin nakakoneg. Sabihin natin may underground tunnel, which is really basically how they are defending themselves.
16:21.7
Remember, occupied sila. Meron silang resistance na ano.
16:25.7
So talagang yung existence ng tunnels is part of long-term defense building nila.
16:31.7
Still, ang question dyan, so naging military target na ba according to internationally-monetary law ang isang hospital kung talagang ginagamit ito for military purposes?
16:43.7
May isa pang, may isa pang, precisely yung sinabi mo ng salita, question of proportionality, may isa pang criteria.
16:51.7
Maski na military target yan, kung hindi na, kung may responsibility ka pa rin na yung impact nung gagawin mong counteract,
17:01.7
yung gagawin mong attack or military operation, should not be so excessive as to create so much damage on civilian infrastructure and civilian life.
17:14.7
So hindi lamang issue na pag dahil military, ginagamit yan for military purposes, legitimate target of attack na yan.
17:23.7
May question pa rin precisely ng proportionality.
17:26.7
So as an, up to now, wala pa naman silang napakita.
17:31.7
Napapakita ang katawan ng isang hamas na nahuhuli nila.
17:35.7
Ang nakikita natin, ang nakikita natin ay panaysirang buildings, sirang, at saka mga tao na talagang lumilikas o kaya na-endure o kaya namatay na nga at linilibing.
17:50.7
So sasakseed ba sila dun sa actual intent na kuhanin yung leadership?
17:58.7
Naging blanket ano na eh.
18:00.7
Naging blanket attacks na eh, di ba?
18:02.7
So talagang major issue itong question ng proportionality.
18:06.7
One hamas or eb hamini, sabihin mo na itong latest statement, di ba, hahanapin namin kayo lahat ng buong hamas, sabi nung Defense Minister ng Israel, maski saan pa kayo.
18:20.7
Pero kung sabihin natin yung membership eh, ilan lang yan, pero yung namatay, ilan, mahigit 11,000 na.
18:30.7
Professor, yun po bang issue ng proportionality? Does it also apply to Hamas, considering na Hamas may be considered as a terrorist organization nung kalaban, pero siya yung nag-govern sa Gaza?
18:43.7
It applies to all. It applies to all.
18:46.7
Apo, paano po yan? Kasi di ba ang response sila noong October 7 was to attack Israel civilians. Pwede bang gamitin naman eh, for the longest time, occupied yung territory, you're treating our citizens like…
18:59.7
So, may war crime din ang Hamas. Meron din silang war crime.
19:04.7
Oo. Pero dahil may war crime na ginawa sa'yo, are you, pwede ka na bang mag-gumawa ng war crime? Hindi nga eh.
19:12.7
At tapos, sobra-sobra na, 1,200. Everyone counts, di ba? May bata, may baba, may matanda, nakasama din sa 1,200. So, talagang attacked on…
19:27.7
Yung attack on civilians, hindi yan mag-justify. Pero ngayon, ikaw naman, bumawi ka. Una, revenge is not a motive for war. Kailangan may political reason ka.
19:40.7
So, ano sinasabi niyang political reason? Actually, secondary or secondary pa nga yung release ng hostages eh. Political or reason para ma…
19:57.7
Ma-mitigate yung nangyari sa iyo. Basically, ito release the hostages. Yung talaga yung pinaka-immediate na dapat mang-goal. Pero ngayon nakikita natin, yung fierceness ng counter-attack, alaki ng motivation niyan, yung revenge na eh.
20:15.7
Yung political objective nga hanggang ngayon, pinag-uusapan pa. Ano ba talaga ang political objective ng Israel?
20:23.7
Itake over ang Gaza?
20:26.7
i-eradicate ang Hamas
20:33.3
the whole of Gaza?
20:36.9
Isa yan sa very important issue
20:38.7
afterward, no? Parang nangyari sa Iraq, no?
20:40.9
After matanggal si Saddam.
20:42.4
What now, no? Ito pala, may nagtatanong po.
20:45.0
Okay lang po ba, Professor?
20:46.5
Maraming interested sa topic na ito.
20:48.4
And this is a learning opportunity for all of us, no?
20:50.8
Ang tanong dito ni
20:54.4
Anong proper response po sa ginawa
20:58.1
Okay, anong proper response?
21:04.3
sa loob ng iyong territory
21:08.1
ang further attacks. Number two,
21:10.0
nag-file ka ng case
21:14.2
Criminal Court. Tapos,
21:18.3
kung kailangan mo ng police arrest, sila na nga
21:20.2
ang security dun eh. Sila'y nagkocontrol sa
21:22.2
ingress-egress sa loob
21:24.2
ng Gaza. Kaya nga,
21:25.9
nagkaroon ng lab sa security nila
21:29.0
naka-attack pa rin itong
21:31.8
ano, di ba? Madami-dami
21:36.0
So, yun, i-address mo yung
21:37.7
security, immediate security
21:39.8
concern mo. And then,
21:41.4
you have the sympathy
21:43.8
of the world. On October 7,
21:45.6
you had the sympathy of the world.
21:51.5
nagkaroon ng political process where
21:53.7
eventually, na-force, mag-step
21:55.7
down ng Hamas. Because Hamas,
21:58.1
like Netanyahu, hindi naman sila
21:59.5
popular na sa sarili nilang constituencies eh.
22:02.4
Correct. Yung isang konteksto.
22:05.0
And then, they have their own
22:07.1
domestic context din, di ba?
22:09.1
Like Netanyahu wants to project
22:13.0
strength. Ganon din naman yung Hamas. Although, marami
22:15.0
rin galit sa kanila. So, you think this should've
22:17.0
been handled largely politically?
22:19.5
Yung political track?
22:21.0
May security track ka dyan, which is
22:23.2
your reinforcement of
22:25.0
your own intelligence.
22:27.3
Yung may power of arrest
22:31.5
because you're practically
22:32.8
the government over the government
22:37.6
Tapos, meron kang
22:38.8
international community.
22:42.8
Inaayos na nga nila actually yung
22:44.6
relationships nila with
22:46.3
the other Arab states.
22:49.6
You would have gotten the
22:50.7
sympathy of the world na,
22:53.2
na tapusin na itong Hamas.
22:55.4
Pabagsakin na yung government ng Hamas.
22:59.2
Pwede na sana yun eh.
23:01.6
Medyo anand there.
23:05.2
Although, mas kinapabagsakin mo yung
23:09.5
as Israel might eventually
23:15.4
you would still have the same problem.
23:19.7
What now, West Bank?
23:23.2
So, ano ba talaga
23:24.9
ang endgame dito?
23:30.1
Hindi naman yan mapapayag
23:31.7
yung buong mundo.
23:33.7
Oo nga eh. So far ngayon kasi talagang
23:35.6
there's a strong public opinion
23:38.0
against Israel. There's a strong public
23:39.9
opinion against Hamas.
23:41.7
Hindi yung mga paristino. At least,
23:43.5
maliwanag yung ganon distinction.
23:45.9
Pero dito po ba, yung
23:47.1
in terms of solutions, ito hindi naman ito bago.
23:49.9
Lagi na, ilang beses na rin naman ito
23:51.5
pinropose. Yung two states,
23:53.2
solution. I mean,
23:54.9
uubra ba yan? Especially with what's happening
23:57.2
now? And how do you
23:59.4
work on something like that?
24:01.2
Kung yung namumuno ngayon doesn't really
24:03.1
recognize the other. And
24:04.9
correct me if I'm wrong, di ba? Ang Hamas
24:06.9
is committed to the destruction of Israel.
24:11.0
tinitingnan yung lahat na yan?
24:16.1
ang mangyayari ngayon kasi
24:19.4
sige, nawala ako.
24:23.2
Medyo nawala. Yung track
24:24.9
ng question mo, paano na
24:27.0
Sorry, medyo loaded kasi yung tanong ko.
24:29.3
Hindi kasi, example, diba yung
24:30.8
two-state solution. Lagi naman binabanggit
24:33.0
nyo. There's a two-state
24:35.1
solution. In the past, syempre,
24:36.9
nire-reject din naman yun ng kabila.
24:38.9
Yung boundaries, nagbago na rin
24:41.0
kasi. Tapos, yun,
24:43.7
na-occupy ng Israel
24:47.1
ang northern Gaza.
24:49.2
Diba? So, ipupush
24:51.0
nyo naman, papayag ba sila
24:52.8
dun sa old boundaries. Ngayon, ang binabalikan
24:55.0
ng mga Arab states,
24:56.6
67, which is basically the
24:58.6
kasi may Oslo process ka at saka meron ka
25:02.6
resolution eh. Yung Oslo Accord
25:08.6
concept niya is to stay, to coexist
25:14.4
nakikita nga natin is parang
25:18.3
pinapalit ng pinapalit yung
25:20.3
territory ng Israel.
25:22.8
Dun sa, lumiit na siya talaga
25:24.9
ng lumiit. So, how do you arrive
25:26.7
at the territorial boundaries? In a way,
25:28.8
alam mo, sa Bangsamoro, ito rin ang
25:30.6
malaking issue namin eh.
25:34.1
1900s, majority yung mga
25:36.3
mga Muslims sa Mindanao,
25:42.3
2000, ilan percent na lang
25:45.0
sila. Kaya, hindi mo
25:46.9
na talaga, hindi na nila maklaim yung sinasabi
25:48.9
nilang Bangsamoro homeland. Kasi,
25:50.8
hanggang ngayon, out of 27,
25:52.8
Princess of Mindanao,
25:54.5
nag-settle na lang sila dito
26:00.9
nag-settle na yung Palestine
26:02.8
sa, dun sa ganun,
26:08.3
resolution at saka yung
26:10.6
pinayagan nila, effectively,
26:13.1
dun sa Oslo Accord.
26:15.8
Pero, apparently,
26:18.7
magiging malabo na, even yung transition.
26:20.8
Who will govern Gaza?
26:22.8
Or even Northern, yung, well,
26:25.1
Northern Gaza and the rest of Gaza,
26:27.4
Southern part, where the people
26:29.1
are now moving to get
26:31.4
out via a chip, diba,
26:33.1
sa Rafa Crossing.
26:35.5
Ang hirap naman kung
26:37.1
ibibigay lang basta-basta
26:41.0
authority. Kasi, in fact,
26:43.5
hesitant ang Palestinian authority
26:45.3
who is ruling the West, who is
26:47.1
governing in the West.
26:54.1
you will really have
26:56.9
to go back to some
26:58.8
basic issues. Ano territorial
27:02.6
papano yung governance structure
27:04.7
dyan? Papano yung
27:10.0
evolve some security
27:12.5
cooperation. Imbis na
27:14.4
if if feed nila yung insecurity
27:18.5
with the help of other states,
27:20.7
really come up with,
27:22.8
a more symmetrical arrangement.
27:25.2
Kasi napaka-asymmetrical,
27:27.2
uneven eh, unequal ng relationship
27:30.8
equalize that relationship. And maybe
27:33.0
you will be able to generate more
27:35.0
security on both sides.
27:37.1
Ano yung ano dyan? Yung
27:38.6
asymmetrical, madalas ko madinigyan nung peace process
27:41.1
naman. Peace talks. Kasi yung peace
27:43.0
process ongoing, you know. Peace talks
27:44.9
with the MILF. Yung asymmetrical
27:46.6
setup between the
27:49.0
Bangsamoro government and the national.
27:50.7
Tama po ba? Doon ginamit dyan eh.
27:52.8
Bakit dito? Ano po yung nakikita
27:54.5
yung low-hanging fruits dito sa Gaza?
27:57.1
Tsaka dito sa Gaza situation?
27:59.0
Kasi for instance, kung bago
28:00.8
bumalik doon sa discussion uli
28:02.7
in earnest ng isang
28:04.5
two-state solution na kung sakali
28:06.7
man, talagang i-recognize ang bawat
28:08.5
isa yung existence ng the other,
28:10.6
tama po ba? So ano yung mga
28:12.6
low-hanging fruits na pwedeng
28:14.6
makamit dito, mapitas?
28:18.8
kung hindi talaga ceasefire eh.
28:21.2
Kasi ano eh, yung
28:22.8
action nag-accumulate,
28:27.0
displacement. Kaya nga,
28:29.0
bakit yung iba kinikriticize ng Egypt,
28:31.0
bakit ayaw nilang payagan mag-ano?
28:33.0
Kasi, gano'n naman
28:34.9
ang plano talaga ng Israel.
28:36.8
If you heard yung
28:38.7
yung isang minister
28:41.2
na dinideclare niya yung plan very
28:42.9
early on, a week after October
28:44.9
7, sinasabi niya,
28:47.0
Egypt will have no choice but to
28:48.8
allow the Palestinians,
28:50.2
tas magkaroon sila
28:54.2
sa territory ng Israel. Which means
28:56.9
basically, you flush out
28:58.4
much of the population
29:00.3
and eventually, you take control
29:02.7
over the territory.
29:08.6
yun yung parang isang
29:10.8
endgame na na-articulate on the
29:14.7
But it's not really the endgame because you will
29:16.8
still have the problem.
29:18.7
So, low-hanging fruit, ceasefire,
29:21.5
release of hostage
29:25.8
Visible yan ng kamit eh. On both sides. Pero ayaw pa
29:28.5
talaga ng Israel tumigil eh.
29:31.8
Pero parang silang
29:32.9
hindi naman willing to negotiate, di ba?
29:34.6
Correct me if I'm wrong. Hindi naman magne-negotiate.
29:36.8
No, there are negotiations. Kaya may paunti-unti.
29:39.7
Everyone else is...
29:42.8
Most Arab states are in negotiations
29:47.3
Di ba? Even si Biden,
29:48.7
sinabi niya, they expect more
29:50.7
release of more hostages.
29:54.7
what circumstances mo naman,
29:56.8
siyempre, lini-leverage ka pa ngayon,
30:00.4
kung gusto nga, humanitarian
30:02.4
post, which is not really the end
30:04.7
of the attacks, but just a post,
30:12.6
negotiations on some
30:14.6
basic issues. So, isa po si Jess,
30:16.7
humanitarian assistance.
30:18.7
Kasi ngayon, nakakat-off ang power supply,
30:20.8
ang fuel, ang water,
30:22.7
ang entry of food supply.
30:25.3
Napaka-basic nun, eh.
30:27.3
Kaya yung mga workers, yung humanitarian
30:28.8
workers, namamatay na sila. Ilan
30:30.6
medics na, ilan new and personnel
30:32.6
na yung namatay, 100 plus,
30:35.0
in the last three
30:36.7
weeks, o mag-ayde,
30:38.5
last four weeks, no?
30:41.9
Hindi rin makapag-deliver
30:43.4
safely. Yung medical
30:44.9
workers, hindi makapag-perform
30:46.8
ng function nila. So, at the
30:48.7
very least, magkaroon
30:52.7
fire, better than just a
30:54.7
humanitarian post.
30:56.8
Kasi, bira mo, four hours a day
30:58.6
ang in-open ng Israel na window
31:00.6
na hindi naman nila
31:04.9
in fact, binomba pa nila kung saan
31:06.6
dumadaan yung mga tao.
31:12.7
next step. That's the immediate next
31:14.5
step, really. Otherwise,
31:19.1
magpapatuloy to for
31:20.6
a few more weeks.
31:24.7
And you will have real, real
31:27.9
yung parang ano na nga, diba?
31:34.2
parang buburahin mo na ba?
31:37.2
Buburahin mo na ba sa face of the
31:38.8
earth yung mga Palestinians
31:40.4
sa Gaza at saka pati unti-unti
31:42.7
pati sa West Bank.
31:44.6
And then you lose the public. You lose the
31:46.7
international community.
31:48.7
So, masyadong nag-brinkmanship din
31:50.5
ang Israel dito eh.
31:52.7
Ang dami na talagang
31:56.5
nag-recall ng kanilang mga ambasador.
31:58.6
Dumadami na, no? Nag-recall ng kanilang
32:00.2
ambasador sa Israel.
32:02.6
Nag-fall apart na yung kanilang
32:07.2
or through yung Abraham
32:08.7
Accords nila with the Arab States.
32:11.6
Nag-fall apart na yan eh.
32:13.4
Nag-re-restore na sila ng
32:14.9
friendly relations with
32:16.7
several Arab states.
32:19.1
In the process sila.
32:21.1
And then, wala na.
32:22.7
Na-antagonize na rin nila yan.
32:24.5
So, papano ka? Israel, isa kang isla
32:27.0
dito sa mundo na, sa Arab world
32:29.4
na to. How can you
32:30.9
really get that kind of security
32:35.1
all your neighbors
32:36.2
and the very people who are also
32:39.2
in that same territory?
32:45.4
Sa amin na mga hindi naman
32:46.9
bihasa dyan sa mga peace-building efforts
32:51.0
Kasi pag pinagmamas din yung mga
32:52.7
images, yung mga balita tungkol dito sa
32:54.6
situation sa Gaza, para
32:56.6
ang hirap mag-optimistic.
32:59.2
I mean, based on your experience,
33:04.5
Pagka binanggit nyo kanina ng ceasefire, no?
33:06.0
Not just sa humanitarian force.
33:09.4
Ano pa yung ibang elements that
33:10.8
could lead to certain milestones?
33:14.9
do you also encourage optimism
33:16.6
dun sa mga, hindi lang sa mga stakeholders
33:18.9
and players, kundi rin sa mga nag-observe?
33:21.3
Given the dire situation now.
33:24.8
International public opinion, which is
33:31.6
tremendously against
33:36.9
For Israel to rethink what it's
33:38.7
doing. And then you need
33:40.5
governments like the US
33:42.9
which could have played
33:43.9
a more neutral role
33:46.8
sinasabi nga eh, kung nag-mediate
33:48.7
na sila from the beginning.
33:50.2
Pero ngayon, hindi na sila pinakinggan eh.
33:52.7
Ilan araw na sila
33:55.1
nananawagan ng humanitarian force
33:57.0
hindi pa binibigay ni Netanyahu.
34:00.7
even they have lost their
34:04.9
And that's why si
34:06.7
Blinken, ang mas kinakausap niya na ngayon
34:08.8
yung mga relying on the
34:12.1
like Qatar, Turkey
34:19.7
So, yun yung dalawa.
34:20.8
You need the big states.
34:24.9
to go on board to the call for a
34:26.8
ceasefire, which UK
34:28.6
might do. I don't know about
34:30.2
Canada, Germany, at saka
34:34.6
US. Baka talagang public
34:36.6
opinion na rin from the US ang magpo-force
34:41.7
finally manawagan na rin ang ceasefire.
34:45.5
Kasi mag-threaten ka na mag-threaten.
34:47.2
Hindi ka na rin pinakinggan ng Israel eh.
34:52.7
Parang ang in-encourage mo
34:55.1
masyado eh. Tapos hindi mo
34:58.9
Mahina yung solution ngayon ni Biden.
35:02.4
Anyway, maraming salamat po. Medyo
35:04.6
pasensya na po kayo. Napahaba yung discussion.
35:06.7
Pero again, as I mentioned, this is a learning experience
35:10.4
Peace building is a very complicated process.
35:12.8
And maraming salamat po, Professor,
35:14.9
dahil maraming po kami napulot
35:16.8
sa inyong karanasan when it comes to
35:18.6
peace negotiations at peace building.
35:21.4
Again, congratulations.
35:22.7
At maraming maraming salamat
35:24.4
for joining us tonight.
35:26.4
Yes. Thank you, Christian. Remember, there are
35:28.6
always other options than
35:30.5
using extreme violence.
35:32.5
I think that's our message.
35:34.6
And then, when you have the violence,
35:37.5
find ways and means to
35:38.6
de-escalate it so that a political
35:40.7
process can happen.
35:43.1
There will be space precisely
35:45.9
political solutions.
35:49.6
That's all. Maraming salamat.
35:52.7
2023 Ramon Magsaysay Awardee
35:54.7
si Professor Miriam
35:56.6
Coronel Ferrer. Magandang gabi po, ma'am.
35:58.5
And again, congratulations po.
