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00:00.0
So, don't worry, may backup naman tayo on the sides.
00:02.8
Now, in the previous episode, of course, we talked about the predicament of the Philippine left
00:07.0
and their latest realignments and working with the traditional elite to push for their agenda.
00:12.5
So, just to summarize, Ronaldo, yung argument mo is that you're saying there are structural limitations na dun sa armed struggle.
00:20.5
So, it's almost inevitable that they'll have to make the big choice.
00:23.5
Whether they'll make that choice is something we'll discuss right now under Marcos Jr.
00:26.7
But what you're saying is that advances in surveillance technology is going to make guerrilla warfare more difficult the way it has been conducted.
00:34.8
You're saying that there has been a generational shift or generational attrition.
00:39.6
And of course, we also saw because of the loss of many of their top leaders, you really have fragmentation within the system.
00:46.1
Not to mention, I think Lelo has done a very good job of saying, ideologically also, hindi sila nag-update.
00:51.0
Yung software siguro ay medyo iPhone 5 pa lang, medyo iPhone 15 na tayo ngayon.
00:55.9
So, put it that way.
00:56.7
Putting all of those factors together, your argument is, it's almost inevitable that they'll make that choice.
01:01.2
So, which brings me to Marcos Jr., right?
01:03.7
So, this episode will be about Marcos Jr.'s potential legacy, both economic, which we'll discuss shortly.
01:09.2
Pag-usapan natin si Elon Musk because he's about to meet Elon Musk this week on the Silence of APEC.
01:14.3
But let's finish muna on this point.
01:16.2
So, you're optimistic or cautiously optimistic that under Marcos Jr., baka mangyari yung dapat nangyari for a very long time.
01:24.7
Ending, effectively, the longest communist administration.
01:26.7
Arguably anywhere in the world.
01:29.6
Is that what you're foreseeing right now?
01:31.7
And now that medyo may political alignment na yung parliamentary side also.
01:36.1
Perte naman ni BBM.
01:39.5
Well, bago nakalaya si Laila, halos yung Duterte forces are preparing themselves to be the new opposition.
01:51.3
To be the new opposition.
01:55.7
They might not survive this interregnum going into the midterm.
02:02.8
Una, ay nakarma si Vice President Sara Duterte na wala yung kanyang hundreds of millions na pwede niyang gamitin sa machinery building.
02:12.8
Sa akong pala, sa...
02:14.7
Pwede niyang gamitin sa...
02:18.0
Alam ko 12 o'clock na pero ingat tayo.
02:21.8
Pwede niyang gamitin sana sa mga safe houses.
02:25.7
Monitoring of insurgency in our universities.
02:29.4
Kasi education, di ba Ronald?
02:31.8
Hindi ko sinasabing ginagamit niya yan sa mga headquarters.
02:34.8
Hindi ko sinasabing na ginagamit niya yan sa mga police.
02:38.0
Ronald Ronald, Secretary of Education yan.
02:41.8
Inaalagaan lang niya ang kapakanan ng ating mga sudyante.
02:45.7
Para sa ROTC yan eh.
02:48.3
Sabi ko ng tatay niya.
02:49.5
Ginagamit niya ng...
02:50.7
Yan, yung confidential fund para sa ROTC.
02:55.7
Pero, parang, parang medyo malabo dahil wala namang ROTC sa high school eh.
03:01.1
Tsaka sa elementary eh.
03:03.6
So, hindi ko alam kung paano mamagigin yun.
03:07.3
Baka naman binigay sa cheque.
03:09.7
Baka naman binigay sa cheque.
03:13.5
Tapos yung kalawa, si Arroyo,
03:15.4
totaly tinanggal na as deputy speaker.
03:18.9
Talagang tinanggal na as deputy speaker.
03:20.6
Tapos, ikatlo, itong last nail on the coffin.
03:25.7
Yung isang episode dati.
03:26.8
The biggest nail on the coffin.
03:31.0
Kung mangyari itong ICC,
03:33.1
eh, hindi na maipoposition ni Ladigong yung sarili nila as the new opposition.
03:38.5
Tapos, nangyari pa si Laila.
03:41.1
Pwedeng yung hindi nagawa last year ni Lenny
03:44.7
na i-harness yung pink wave
03:48.5
through a nationwide Thanksgiving and listening tour.
03:52.9
Pwede nga yung gawin niya ni Laila.
03:55.7
In a different context.
03:57.5
A nationwide Thanksgiving tour and listening tour
04:00.4
together with Risa
04:01.6
to harness what remains of the pink wave.
04:05.6
Para, pagdating lang midterm,
04:07.7
may kaunti kang tunay na opposition.
04:10.7
Not the Duterte opposition.
04:13.4
Na hindi mangyayari kung hindi nakalaya si Laila.
04:17.6
Alam ko, gabi na.
04:18.4
Ayoko, mapagod ka.
04:19.4
I'll give you some rest time.
04:21.0
Baka magkamali ka.
04:21.9
Delikado tayo dyan.
04:24.1
I think Ronald is essentially saying
04:26.3
that it's almost inevitable
04:27.3
that some on the far left
04:29.0
will have to move to the center left.
04:31.2
Do you see a possibility, Leloy?
04:32.6
Or are you looking forward to
04:34.1
for that matter of,
04:35.2
let's say, more Risa and Franz Castro working?
04:37.7
Those types of people working together
04:39.3
as part of a new mitochondria
04:42.8
of a revived opposition
04:44.3
as Ronald has been talking about.
04:45.7
Alam mo yung isa pang possibility nito
04:48.3
is split yung left.
04:50.2
I mean, babalikan lang natin
04:51.8
yung negotiations na
04:55.4
kung naiuwi ni Ronald
04:56.6
yung resolution nun,
04:59.4
hindi lang bayani si Ronald,
05:01.4
kundi he might have actually triggered
05:03.2
another split in the left.
05:04.8
Kasi sa tingin ko,
05:05.8
hindi lahat papanig kay Tatang.
05:08.4
May mga hardliners na mananatili.
05:11.4
So, ang mangyayari doon,
05:12.9
meron kang left na papasok sa gobyerno
05:15.4
o magiging kaalyado ng gobyerno.
05:18.3
meron kang sobrang hardliner
05:20.6
Pero, essentially,
05:22.2
pag gano'n nakaliit,
05:25.2
weren't you using the words
05:27.5
Pag gano'n nakaliit,
05:29.9
police action na lang yun,
05:31.2
hindi na yung insurgency.
05:33.4
baka gano'n yung mangyari.
05:34.6
Kung ma-split mo na gano'n,
05:36.6
maybe yung mga tao na,
05:38.3
lumayo na from the armed struggle,
05:40.7
yung baka maging mga katropa
05:42.3
ni Risa sa Senado
05:46.6
I really like that.
05:47.9
That would be nice.
05:53.7
or something like that?
05:55.0
Kasi tingin mo kaya
05:56.3
parang ganyan yun do?
06:04.1
Dahil magkakaroon yan
06:07.4
gestation period,
06:10.9
at trust building.
06:13.6
kailangan ng panahon
06:16.8
So, hindi yan mangyayari
06:29.1
from a Maoist ideology,
06:31.7
social democratic
06:34.3
liberal democratic.
06:37.1
Hindi yan ganong kabilis,
06:38.9
Hindi yan ganong kabilis,
06:41.4
jogging in place,
06:42.8
others will lie low,
06:44.8
Baka nga mas marami
06:45.8
yung mag-lie low, eh.
06:49.2
dahil disillusion,
06:51.1
With their leadership,
06:52.2
with their ideology,
06:54.5
might reinvent themselves
06:58.2
into a different ideology.
07:01.0
I doubt kung yung majority
07:02.6
ng pinag-uusapan natin
07:05.3
ay gagawin yung ganyang klaseng
07:08.2
political and ideological transition
07:14.0
Tingin ko mas marami
07:15.7
sa pagkakakakilala ko dun sa
07:23.0
yung sinasabi nga ni Leloy
07:24.7
na a small minority,
07:27.8
which can also be dangerous
07:31.9
a hundred suicide bombers
07:34.5
to create habok, eh.
07:37.7
kung merong matitira sa'yo
07:39.4
na a few hundreds
07:40.4
na very hardline,
07:44.4
delikado pa rin yan.
07:46.1
I think most will lie low.
07:48.5
Dito rin siguro makita
07:50.8
Dito natin makikita
07:52.6
ideological indoctrination.
07:55.2
Kasi kung mababaw
07:57.9
eh, madali rin magunaw.
07:59.2
Pero kung talagang malalim
08:00.5
at taong-taon mong inaral,
08:05.1
siguro mahirap matibag yun
08:08.0
Dito sa US, actually,
08:11.5
ideological indoctrination.
08:13.4
At least yung mga sudyante dito
08:14.8
na fans ng makabayan,
08:17.0
hindi na nila naiintindihan
08:18.2
yung poll spec ng Pilipinas.
08:19.7
Ewan ko, sa Pilipinas,
08:20.8
siguro mas malalim pa.
08:22.6
for example, dito,
08:24.7
hinohos namin si Risa dito,
08:26.2
bak, pinaligiran ng
08:29.8
At hindi rin na rally,
08:32.2
humihingi ng autograph
08:35.3
Ewan ko kung gano'n.
08:35.9
Ewan ko kung gano'n sa Pilipinas.
08:36.4
That's what I'm saying.
08:37.7
is what it takes to bring
08:43.5
dahil mababaw na lang
08:45.9
yung political indoctrination
08:47.9
kaya nangyari yun.
08:50.0
sa mga Amerikano,
08:51.0
siguro masasakal lang,
08:52.6
identification with the Philippines
08:54.8
identification with the political cause.
08:56.8
Kaya kayang mga mawis dyan,
09:01.1
identity issues, eh.
09:03.9
Kita nila si Risa,
09:11.4
Identity politics can bring them together.
09:14.0
So, if there's a disagreement
09:14.9
on political economy
09:16.2
and revolutionary agenda,
09:18.7
Kasi kahit yung mga staff ni Risa,
09:21.8
gulat na gulat din.
09:22.6
Bakit kami inayakap dito
09:25.1
Ay, sininayakap talaga, ha?
09:28.6
Mas ang strong point dyan,
09:31.8
is the organizing tactics, eh.
09:35.3
Less about ideology.
09:37.4
Ang hirap ipaliwanag sa mga
09:40.5
yung Maoist ideology
09:42.4
as the cornerstone of their activism.
09:45.4
Pwedeng pasadahan,
09:48.0
pwedeng banggitin,
09:49.7
pwedeng hindi banatan.
09:50.7
Pero yung organizing dyan,
09:52.6
mas issue-based, eh.
09:55.5
Yung dominant aspect
09:57.5
ng organizing nila dyan.
10:01.6
So, it looks like
10:02.7
not only there's a chance
10:06.5
communist insurgency,
10:07.9
but there's a chance
10:08.4
that there'll be even
10:09.1
a new revived opposition.
10:10.8
So, he might have
10:11.5
a good legacy after all.
10:15.9
Not doing anything.
10:17.2
one of the elephants
10:19.9
ma-improve ba ni Marcos?
10:25.4
mag-deteriorate yung economy?
10:28.4
ideological foundations
10:33.8
ng Communist Party,
10:35.9
baka tumagal pa lang
10:38.4
yung kanilang demise.
10:41.1
dahil yung economy,
10:43.9
hindi ko siya nakikita
10:46.2
dramatically, eh.
10:47.2
Baka pa nga mag-deteriorate, eh.
10:49.0
If Marcos don't play
10:50.3
his cards right, no?
10:52.4
yung sinasabi nilang
10:54.7
bumabiyay si Marcos, eh.
11:01.0
80 to 90 billion dollars,
11:04.6
Eh, wala pa naman
11:05.3
pumapasok ni 1 billion, eh.
11:07.5
Ngayon, bago na naman
11:09.3
Mga bagong commitments
11:10.5
na naman yan, no?
11:12.0
Et cetera, et cetera.
11:13.0
Pero, walang pumapasok, eh.
11:14.6
Hindi lang naman yung
11:15.3
Chinese 22 billion commitment
11:17.5
ang hindi papasok, eh.
11:22.4
pagkamat may kaunting
11:27.7
sa panahon ni BBM
11:31.3
negative yung net flow.
11:36.2
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
11:37.1
Kaya sinasabi ko, ah,
11:38.2
kahit may ganong klaseng
11:41.1
dahil sinasabi kasi
11:45.5
oh, magpapump prime kami
11:47.9
Et cetera, et cetera.
11:49.1
Bagamat lumalabas
11:52.4
ay lumabas, di ba?
11:53.7
Hindi lang nga pumapasok,
11:55.1
pero lumalabas pa, di ba?
11:56.5
Yun yung sinasabi kong
11:59.4
hindi necessarily na
12:03.8
hindi necessarily
12:17.0
ano bang gagawin?
12:18.5
Andali rin kasing maging,
12:20.1
yung, yung isa kasi,
12:22.8
expression ng economy
12:27.8
Hindi dahil magaling yun
12:30.7
yung circumstances,
12:31.8
yung population natin,
12:33.0
at saka yung region natin,
12:34.1
ASEAN's the fastest
12:34.9
growing region in the world,
12:36.8
we're the fastest growing,
12:38.7
or we're the fastest
12:39.4
growing ASEAN country.
12:40.9
So, kahit ungu yung
12:41.7
ilagay mo sa Malacanang,
12:44.2
talagang lalago na lalago
12:46.2
Kahit bakante nga.
12:47.3
Sabi ko, kahit bakante pa.
12:48.8
Kahit bakante nga.
12:51.1
it can theoretically,
12:52.4
breed complacency,
12:54.7
laging nagkakaroon ng good news
12:59.1
sobrang lakas ng Pilipinas
13:00.9
nag-grow yung economy,
13:02.9
but at the same time,
13:03.8
bumaba yung inflation.
13:04.9
At dahil bumaba yung inflation,
13:06.7
mukhang the central bank
13:07.9
will end yung period
13:09.8
which will further charge
13:16.4
lalago ulit yung ekonomiya.
13:18.1
kung ganyan lang yung tinginan mo,
13:20.3
ang daling maging complacent.
13:22.4
those particular circumstances,
13:24.9
wala naman dun sa mga,
13:26.2
wala dun sa growth na yun
13:31.3
externally induced.
13:33.5
baka bumaba yung inflation,
13:35.2
yung rate hikes sa US
13:36.1
hindi na kasing aggressive,
13:37.4
hindi na rin natin kailangan.
13:39.2
mababa na yung inflation sa US,
13:43.6
Yung rate hikes sa US
13:44.8
hindi na kasing aggressive,
13:46.0
hindi na rin natin kailangan
13:47.1
maging kasing aggressive
13:49.1
mag-grow yung economy natin.
13:51.3
at the same time,
13:52.4
yung spending ng gobyerno
13:55.5
na hindi nagawa dun sa first half,
13:57.2
na ilabas na nila ngayon,
13:58.4
kaya nag-grow yung economy.
14:00.2
at the same time,
14:02.0
hindi na rin mag-rate hikes
14:05.8
beginning of 2024,
14:08.0
very few of those circumstances
14:12.5
Kaya sinasabi ko,
14:13.4
ang daling maging complacent
14:14.8
kung ikaw ang presidente
14:15.4
ng Pilipinas ngayon.
14:17.6
Before I go to...
14:18.1
Malinaw na yung consumption
14:20.4
ay hindi nag-increase,
14:22.4
Private investment
14:23.5
hindi nag-increase.
14:25.9
na yung Gini coefficient natin
14:28.6
ay nasa ganun palikaking level.
14:31.8
Walang nag-improve
14:34.6
I just wanna stop there
14:36.5
kasi very interesting
14:38.3
what we're saying,
14:39.9
what we're saying,
14:40.7
sa political front,
14:42.2
there is a structural opportunity
14:46.1
almost by default,
14:47.1
oversee some major changes.
14:50.0
the semi-evisceration
14:52.4
that has bedeviled
14:53.7
the country for quite some time.
14:55.8
the roots of that
14:56.5
goes to dictatorship,
14:58.9
to the second point.
15:00.9
What Lelo is saying,
15:03.7
just structurally write
15:06.7
kind of economic development
15:08.1
because that could backfire
15:09.6
and eventually undermine
15:10.9
the political opportunity
15:12.6
for structural transfer.
15:14.6
Kasi connected yan, eh.
15:15.9
Which gets me to this point,
15:20.7
what can we really expect
15:23.4
beyond performative
15:24.8
economics, right?
15:27.0
Because his economics
15:27.7
is just standard macroeconomic
15:29.2
prudential economics
15:32.4
commercial diplomacy, right?
15:34.4
So, the latest big time
15:37.8
So, expect in the coming days,
15:40.5
BBM meeting Elon Musk,
15:41.9
Elon Musk making promises
15:45.3
Tesla, Philippines,
15:46.4
blah, blah, blah.
15:47.4
But ang mahal na electricity,
15:49.1
ang pangit pa rin na infrastructure,
15:51.3
On and on and on,
15:52.1
kontrolado pa rin
15:54.5
yung commanding heights
15:56.9
So, I mean, realistically,
15:58.3
do you think that
16:01.2
na we have been surprised
16:02.2
with some interesting
16:03.0
political things,
16:04.4
I know that we said
16:05.3
it's conflict avoidant,
16:06.3
but at the same time,
16:07.1
some changes and shifts
16:11.7
na hindi niya kaya gawin
16:13.3
yung sinasabi lang ni Lelo
16:14.7
na makikiride lang
16:16.3
doon sa demographic momento,
16:19.1
dahil na ang hirap natin,
16:20.3
ang baba ng per capita,
16:22.0
and it's really nothing magical.
16:24.3
Do you think eventually,
16:25.1
both of you guys,
16:26.3
do you think at some point,
16:27.3
baka magising si BBM
16:29.2
ng mga advice niya,
16:30.2
Sir, kailangan mo nang,
16:31.5
you need to leave
16:32.2
something major behind.
16:34.2
big investments in.
16:35.7
You need to really
16:36.2
get the utility sector,
16:38.1
basic ingredients
16:38.9
of economic development going.
16:40.3
You need to have,
16:41.1
as I always put it,
16:42.2
some element of industrial policy
16:44.3
which is back in vogue
16:47.0
Kahit huwag na natin
16:48.3
progressive economics,
16:49.6
pag-usapan na rin natin
16:54.2
yung dominant class
16:58.4
Even within that framework,
17:01.0
hindi may iiwasan ni BBM
17:02.9
na ayusin yung comparative
17:04.7
advantage ng bansa.
17:07.6
Because yung inaasahan nila
17:09.6
kasi investments,
17:11.5
lumalabas pa nga,
17:14.4
So itong sinasabi
17:17.1
ng kaibigan natin
17:19.1
na mga investments
17:23.1
hindi yan papasok
17:24.1
hanggat yung comparative
17:28.2
ay ganyan pa rin.
17:36.6
pinagmamalaki ni Jock
17:40.3
fastest growing economy
17:41.6
in the ASEAN region,
17:45.2
nalampasan na tayo
17:47.2
At kung hindi magbabago
17:48.4
yung ating comparative advantage,
17:51.1
in the next five,
17:55.6
yun ang kailangang
17:57.7
ayusin ni BBM, eh.
18:00.8
Yung comparative advantage
18:11.9
ay matindi pa rin, eh.
18:15.9
nababalitaan, eh.
18:19.1
ang dami kong nababalitaan.
18:21.8
nababalitaan ni Maharlika.
18:22.5
Eh, hindi, hindi.
18:23.3
Mga listening posts ko, eh.
18:25.6
Marami nagreklamo, eh.
18:27.3
So, kailangan talagang
18:31.4
itong mga hoarders,
18:32.8
itong mga smugglers,
18:36.5
nung nakaraan niyang sola,
18:42.1
Wala akong alam ni isa, eh.
18:43.7
Hindi nakulong, eh.
18:45.0
yun yung sinabi niya
18:45.8
sa sola niya, ah.
18:46.8
Yun yung sinabi ni Speaker Romualdez,
18:48.6
nag-raid-raid pa siya,
18:51.3
kailangan mo nag-raid ka
18:52.0
tapos wala na kulong?
18:53.8
on that second aspect,
18:56.0
kailangan meron ka ipakita, eh.
18:58.3
Kailangan meron ka ipakita.
18:59.1
Yung nga, Ronald,
19:00.0
we agree on that.
19:00.8
But, do you think,
19:02.6
what can we expect
19:05.0
Hindi naman siya tanga,
19:06.4
nagigets naman niya
19:08.2
and at some point,
19:09.0
there are times na he showed
19:11.3
political astuteness.
19:13.7
kailangan niyang paltan
19:15.2
ng kanyang cabinet.
19:17.7
kailangan niyang paltan
19:19.2
ng kanyang cabinet.
19:31.5
ipalit politisyan.
19:32.8
Paano mukhang yung
19:33.4
ipapalit politiko, eh?
19:36.4
Okay lang paltan si Jokno.
19:40.3
within their own framework,
19:45.0
Pero ayaw na ata.
19:49.8
Siguro papayag yun.
19:51.8
Pero kumpara kay Jokno,
19:53.9
Philip yung kanyang numero,
19:55.1
yung kanyang numbers.
19:57.7
parang political na eh.
20:00.3
hindi na siya akwal eh.
20:06.7
to improve the government
20:13.3
change the narrative.
20:15.2
Change the narrative.
20:20.0
Dahil yung kanyang
20:26.6
hindi nangyari yan
20:27.4
sa mga previous presidents.
20:30.7
15% yung binabamo.
20:32.5
Kung magpapatuloyan
20:35.1
So, hindi lang yung mga
20:35.7
Duterte ang delikado.
20:39.1
walang strong opposition.
20:43.1
yung ganong klaseng downtrend.
20:51.0
what's your take?
20:56.0
magre-rebump siya.
20:57.4
Pero walang nangyari.
21:02.0
Ang significant lang
21:06.9
Kabi ang secretary
21:17.1
maybe I'll ask also
21:19.5
kind of put aside
21:22.9
I won't even say progressive.
21:24.0
I would say standard
21:25.2
industrial policy,
21:27.2
investment strategy.
21:32.9
about the failure
21:33.6
of the Philippines
21:34.4
developmental state
21:36.7
Something along those lines,
21:39.1
of macro-prudential,
21:43.2
new liberal economics,
21:45.5
hindi yan nag-work eh.
21:47.3
Filipino's living standard
21:48.5
is still not there.
21:49.7
coming on middle class,
21:51.7
Napag-iwanan talaga tayo
21:52.7
ng ibang middle class
21:54.5
and many other countries.
21:57.3
we're reaching a point of
22:00.1
a critical juncture
22:02.8
na kailangan talaga
22:03.6
na the Philippines
22:04.3
embraces something new?
22:10.4
si Jocno is a perfect example.
22:11.8
We're just going to be complacent
22:15.0
ewan kong minang nangyayari
22:16.9
pag pumapasok sila
22:19.0
nagiging macro-prudential.
22:20.3
Pag nasa labas ng gobyerno,
22:22.2
ang lakas mag-propose
22:23.3
ng industrial policy
22:24.3
or the fundamental rethinking
22:25.8
of the economic premises
22:27.7
of the Philippines.
22:30.7
kaaway yan ng Central Bank
22:33.8
Nung panahon ni Ramos,
22:37.1
na jukebox economist.
22:39.8
maglalagay ka ng pera
22:42.1
tapos kakantahin niya
22:43.1
yung gusto mong kantahin.
22:47.3
nung panahon na yun
22:48.1
because in the 1990s,
22:49.6
in order to avert
22:50.3
the Asian financial crisis,
22:51.7
Jocno, along with
22:54.6
Calixto Chiquiamco,
22:58.4
a strategic depreciation
23:01.5
obsession ko, Richard,
23:02.7
the strategic depreciation
23:06.6
na naging Central Bank
23:12.4
ito na yung pantasya niya
23:14.4
strategically depreciate
23:16.4
Hindi niya ginawa.
23:17.8
he was associated
23:22.0
So, bakit important
23:22.8
yung strategic depreciation
23:24.7
Because it is the ultimate,
23:27.0
it is the ultimate
23:28.0
protectionist measure
23:29.1
for your exporters.
23:30.7
It's the ultimate form
23:31.7
of protectionism.
23:33.0
Kaya nga yung mga
23:33.6
naging depreciate ng peso,
23:34.9
nagagalit yung mga,
23:36.0
nagagalit ang uses.
23:38.9
currency manipulator.
23:40.8
tinatawag na currency
23:41.6
manipulator right now.
23:43.0
So, I think there's
23:43.7
something really about
23:46.9
na kapag pumasok ka,
23:50.1
What you're saying
23:50.8
is that the bureaucracy...
23:54.8
Pero yung Central Bank,
23:57.4
should be reformed.
23:59.5
That's one thing.
24:00.5
It is an institution
24:01.3
that really, really
24:02.1
should be reformed.
24:06.1
Ang Indonesia actually
24:06.9
nag-Central Bank reform yan.
24:09.0
Central Bank ng Indonesia
24:13.8
our Central Bank.
24:14.7
Inflation targeting bank.
24:16.3
Walang developmental goal.
24:18.1
So, single mandate
24:20.8
ang Indonesian Central Bank.
24:22.1
Dual mandate na yan.
24:24.5
may developmental goal na.
24:26.1
Yung Central Bank natin,
24:27.8
developmental goal.
24:29.5
So, what that means
24:32.7
ultra-low inflation,
24:34.9
growth and employment,
24:36.3
and developmental
24:39.5
will always choose
24:42.6
So, wala siyang balance.
24:45.5
Ngayon, yung mga ibang
24:46.6
binabalansin nila yung goals
24:48.5
at goals ng low inflation.
24:49.9
Yung Central Bank,
24:50.1
yung Central Bank natin,
24:50.9
walang ganyang kasing goal.
24:52.3
Kaya, ang sabi nga ni
24:54.8
ng governor ng Central Bank,
24:56.8
we are an inherently
24:58.3
hawkish Central Bank.
25:00.1
Kaya, kita mo kung
25:01.0
mag-slash ng rates
25:02.7
Do you know, for example,
25:05.3
itong last wave ng inflation,
25:06.6
tayo yung pinaka-aggressive
25:07.7
nagtaas ng interest rate
25:10.4
Pinaka-aggressive.
25:12.8
mismong si R.C. Balisakan,
25:16.0
Gov, masakit na po.
25:18.3
Walang pakailang si governor.
25:21.9
myth of Central Bank independence,
25:25.3
which is actually,
25:26.3
it's actually bullshit,
25:27.5
yung myth of Central Bank independence.
25:30.0
Ano yung other institution
25:32.4
na so-called independence
25:35.4
It's the Supreme Court,
25:37.8
pero hindi mo na pwede
25:39.8
nominally independent.
25:41.0
Pero lahat ng Pilipino,
25:42.2
alam naman nila na bullshit
25:43.2
ang Supreme Court independence,
25:44.8
na bahagihan ng politika.
25:46.6
when we think about
25:47.3
the Central Bank,
25:47.9
Wala akong sinabi, ah.
25:50.3
when we think about the Central Bank,
25:53.8
the same kind of cynicism.
25:56.3
na talagang beyond politics yan.
25:57.8
Ulol mo kung beyond politics yan.
25:59.9
Central Bank is part
26:01.8
of the Philippines.
26:03.2
has stakeholders.
26:04.1
May accountability yan.
26:05.7
And it's accountable
26:06.7
to a particular banker class
26:08.5
na ang gusto lang nila
26:09.6
protect the value
26:12.0
grow the economy.
26:15.6
fundamental reorientation
26:17.7
and then Filipinos
26:20.3
care about the Central Bank
26:21.4
the way they care
26:22.0
about the Supreme Court
26:22.9
which is not a lot
26:23.9
but they care about
26:24.5
the Supreme Court
26:25.2
more than they do
26:25.8
the Central Bank.
26:27.9
I want to push you on this
26:28.7
because I want this to be
26:29.6
the last part of our discussion.
26:31.1
this is what I find unique, no?
26:34.6
We always talk about
26:36.9
We always talk about
26:37.7
political dynasties
26:40.3
to the Philippine democracy
26:41.5
and political economy.
26:42.6
But what I and Leloy
26:44.6
have been emphasizing
26:45.4
over the past year or so
26:47.0
since some of our
26:48.6
with some of our friends,
26:50.1
you also have to look at
26:52.8
Filipino technocrats.
26:55.0
interesting Leloy
26:55.7
is saying here is that
26:56.6
even yung mga progressive
26:57.8
or matino mag-isip,
26:59.7
once nandun na sila
27:01.3
there's just something
27:02.1
with the bureaucracy,
27:04.4
banking bureaucracy
27:05.6
in the Philippines
27:11.1
kind of technocrat.
27:15.4
in the Aquino administration
27:17.2
criticism against
27:18.0
the Aquino administration
27:22.6
significant in terms
27:24.0
and trade policy.
27:26.5
ganyan ba kalakas?
27:28.4
deep state talaga
27:30.7
Hindi yung mga trapoy.
27:33.6
Leloy, I'll push it.
27:35.9
liberal technocracy
27:39.8
yung sinasabing Leloy
27:40.7
is yung mga mayayaman
27:44.8
they have an interest
27:45.7
na mababa yung inflation
27:47.8
inflation is higher
27:48.7
than interest rate,
27:53.1
inflation strategy
27:56.4
but not necessarily
28:03.2
yung ganyang klaseng
28:04.6
is asset protection.
28:06.2
Ang anti-inflation
28:14.0
production processes.
28:21.0
dahil gusto namin
28:23.4
the interest rate
28:25.6
na ginagamit nila
28:40.6
Kaya huwag nyo tayong
28:42.3
yung anti-inflation
28:43.9
Sinabi mo na yan,
28:45.5
sana itatanong ko
28:53.7
sa interest rates
28:56.9
sa food inflation?
28:59.9
ng productivity eh.
29:07.8
Organic intellectual
29:21.4
gobyerno ni Pinoy
29:23.4
anti-corruption eh.
29:26.4
yung strong point eh.
29:28.5
yung economic paradigm
29:30.1
ay hindi naman talaga
29:34.4
ang hirap din gumawa
29:35.5
ng economic paradigm
29:38.1
In less than six years.
29:41.7
is a learning curve
29:42.8
at yung last year mo
29:46.7
you have to implement
29:49.5
economic paradigm
29:53.1
we don't have an ideological state,
29:57.9
where do we start?
30:00.1
yan yung magiging usapin natin eh.
30:02.3
I'll push back against you,
30:05.3
just two years into office,
30:08.4
and many journalists
30:09.5
believe that he has
30:10.3
actually introduced
30:11.1
an industrial policy
30:12.3
revolution in America.
30:14.2
you can argue that
30:14.9
there was the pandemic,
30:16.0
there was the Donald Trump
30:18.5
but if you really
30:24.1
this very good article
30:25.1
about end of new liberalism
30:27.3
since Biden came to power,
30:29.9
Sobrang laki nung contribution
30:31.3
to infrastructure development,
30:33.3
building high-tech industry.
30:36.1
Biden was able to make
30:37.1
that transformation.
30:38.0
And I'll go even more historically,
30:40.8
of Abraham Lincoln.
30:43.6
three or four years,
30:44.4
he transformed America's history
30:47.3
even human history,
30:49.6
I get what you're saying,
30:51.4
is your argument,
30:52.4
is that the Philippine state
30:56.4
as four years in America,
30:58.2
including 19th century America?
31:01.1
I get your point,
31:02.2
pero ang point ko is,
31:03.4
pwede maging excuse yan,
31:05.3
kulang lang four years,
31:06.6
I can give you many examples
31:07.7
of massive transformation
31:09.2
in two or three years
31:13.5
is not like our state,
31:17.7
kahit pa pano naman,
31:19.6
has an ideological
31:24.4
Yung sa atin talaga,
31:31.3
yun yung isang kaibahan
31:32.9
na pwedeng magkaroon
31:35.2
ng ganyang klaseng
31:39.0
the nature of the U.S. state.
31:42.3
how much can you change?
31:44.5
How much can you change?
31:50.1
na kailangan mong baguhin,
31:55.3
napag-usapan namin ni,
31:57.2
yung mga cartels,
31:59.8
medyo inclined siya
32:00.9
na durugin yung mga yan,
32:07.8
Sabi ko nga sa kanya,
32:09.1
huwag mo napansinan niya
32:09.9
yung rule of law.
32:10.5
Hindi natin madudurug
32:11.5
yung mga cartels na yan
32:12.5
kung puno rule of law tayo,
32:14.8
Kakampi ko pa nga
32:15.6
si Senator Magsaysay,
32:17.5
nung kinakausap namin
32:20.2
si Pinoy tungkol dyan,
32:22.3
Dahil gusto niyang,
32:23.8
gusto niyang simulan
32:24.5
ng katahin yung cartel, eh.
32:26.0
Medyo magdigong na siya.
32:27.8
Hamstrung siya ng,
32:28.6
hamstrung siya ng,
32:44.3
nung nagkakuan tayo,
32:45.6
nag-session tayo sa,
32:46.9
yung first session,
32:47.3
yung first session,
32:47.5
yung first session natin
32:50.6
ang tanong mo sa akin,
32:52.4
gusto mo maging Digong?
32:53.8
Tama pala si Digong,
32:55.7
Yan ang tanong mo.
32:56.4
Yun yung real talk mo,
32:57.9
May TikTok video tayo
33:00.7
Maganda yung TikTok video na,
33:02.1
could you be a good dictator
33:04.2
to shake up the system,
33:11.0
Digong was really fake
33:12.8
because he had his own
33:14.9
short of a dictatorship
33:19.9
What can we do here?
33:21.7
I think we're doing the first step
33:23.3
which is exposing
33:24.1
the very negative impact
33:25.6
of the technocratic class
33:27.2
in the Philippines
33:27.8
who essentially have served
33:29.2
the interests of the capitalists,
33:30.8
the bourgeois class here.
33:34.9
meron mo tayo kahit maliit
33:36.5
na modernizing elite
33:38.4
or at least man lang
33:39.7
a section of that
33:44.9
kung wala kasi yan,
33:48.9
socialism should be the agenda.
33:51.8
Kung wala man lang na
33:55.7
sa exciting part.
34:00.4
ang sagot ko dyan
34:04.9
tumakbo si Guibo.
34:10.4
even some socialists
34:12.1
he's so reminiscent
34:14.8
modernizing elite
34:19.9
malalim mag-isip,
34:21.3
very technocratic.
34:22.9
And siguro parang Mahatir,
34:25.1
some philosophers
34:25.8
kagaya na nabanggit natin.
34:28.4
Parang kay Ronald.
34:29.7
Naku-confuse natin
34:30.4
si Anwar at si Mahatir.
34:31.7
Matalino rin si Mahatir.
34:33.0
Matalino rin si Mahatir.
34:33.3
I wonder what that says.
34:38.1
Ako yung favorite ko dyan,
34:39.3
si Salvador Araneta.
34:40.3
Matagal ko nang sinasabi
34:41.4
sa mga listeners natin
34:43.6
tignan yung early
34:45.7
Christian democracy
34:47.4
kung babasahin ngayon
34:48.7
makikita natin talaga na
34:51.2
yung pinag-promote niya
34:54.4
one of the reasons
34:55.2
why hindi pinapakinggan
34:56.4
si Salvador Araneta
34:57.5
ay dahil inelite tag siya
35:05.5
about the country
35:09.9
ng connection siya
35:10.6
with the sugar industry.
35:12.8
yung kanyang mga ideas
35:15.9
kasi yung peso depreciation
35:17.8
one of the reasons
35:18.3
bakit ayaw yan nakaliwa
35:19.5
kasi naging agenda yan
35:21.8
naging agenda yan
35:26.9
the first proponent
35:29.0
peso depreciation
35:30.2
was Salvador Araneta
35:35.1
exiled by Ferdinand Marcos.
35:39.2
salamat Ferdinand Marcos
35:40.3
at dinipreciate mo
35:45.7
may ganyan talagang
35:47.9
Araneta tradition,
35:49.2
strategic peso depreciation,
35:51.8
export protection,
35:54.3
Christian democracy,
35:56.0
Christian social democracy
35:57.6
na pwedeng buhayin.
36:02.9
Malapit nang buksan
36:04.7
ni Salvador Araneta.
36:06.4
finally ng archivist.
36:09.6
a lot of our elites
36:18.7
of the 19th century.
36:21.5
is there could be
36:22.2
kind of a noble oblige
36:28.9
which is essentially
36:36.4
Kuomintang in Taiwan,
36:40.1
who had developmental
36:45.8
Don Badong is closed.
36:48.1
may nakikita kang ganun?
36:50.6
Ako, wala akong makita.
36:51.8
We thought Maroas
36:53.0
is that guy, right?
36:55.0
Maroas could be that guy.
36:56.5
Kind of a noble oblige,
36:57.7
one of the elite,
36:58.4
but at least naisip niya,
36:59.5
blah, blah, blah.
37:00.5
naging masyadong politiko na.
37:02.8
Actually, naisip ko lang,
37:03.9
sobrang relevant yun
37:06.5
cabinet portfolio
37:09.1
Secretary of Agriculture,
37:11.6
the most important
37:12.8
cabinet portfolio today.
37:16.2
yung kanyang legacy.
37:21.2
what do you guys think
37:21.8
of Guibo Teodoro?
37:23.1
That's a very good point, bro.
37:25.0
Let's end on Guibo na lang.
37:26.2
We wanted to end on
37:27.9
He became irrelevant
37:32.5
obviously, may planong
37:33.9
magpresidente ulit.
37:35.3
I mean, I can't...
37:35.9
Yes, he has ambitions.
37:37.2
That's what he's telling me
37:41.0
ka-close ni speaker.
37:42.8
They look at each other
37:46.0
as potential rivals.
37:54.5
Yung dalawa na yan.
37:56.4
But that could be fixed,
37:57.8
If Sara is marginalized
38:00.3
is convinced not to run
38:01.6
for the presidency
38:02.7
but settle for VP,
38:08.4
Yeah, but, you know,
38:09.6
eventually, Tulfo may be
38:10.6
convinced to run as VP,
38:12.8
do you think he's gonna
38:15.8
For now, I think he will
38:17.9
For the gold, no?
38:21.0
Masyado siya mataas
38:23.7
lalo if Sara goes down, no?
38:26.2
Parang magiging parang
38:27.7
Parang ako yung mataas
38:29.2
Bakit ako yung magsislide down?
38:30.5
Parang may ganyang sense
38:31.3
na ita mangyayari
38:32.0
kay Rafi Tulfo, eh, no?
38:41.1
Ano tingin nyo kay Guibo?
38:42.8
may modernizing impulse
38:46.3
I want to start with you.
38:50.1
Thank you, Lelo, ya.
38:52.4
That came out of nowhere, ah.
38:53.6
Hindi ko na-expect
38:54.4
na we'll end on Guibo
38:57.1
babalikan ko si Frankie
39:01.4
sinabi niya sa akin.
39:04.4
during the period
39:06.4
modernizing elites,
39:09.1
Tapos sabi niya sa akin,
39:11.1
reminds me of these people.
39:12.8
Yun yung sabi ni Frankie
39:18.4
at least nakalaya na siya
39:19.7
doon sa taint ni GMA.
39:22.6
sa naging millstone niya
39:23.9
nung tumakbo siya.
39:28.3
corrupt presidents
39:31.3
at saka endorser.
39:34.0
medyo nasira siya ron.
39:36.1
sa kanyang handling
39:39.1
na typhoon lang pala
39:41.1
hindi niya kayang
39:46.7
ay yung kanyang relationship
39:48.8
na nag-unravel din.
39:53.0
Kaya, hindi ko alam
39:54.0
kung sino pa yung
39:54.9
iba niyang supporter
40:01.9
a section of the elites,
40:04.9
I'm talking about
40:05.7
a section of the elites,
40:06.8
not an individual elite.
40:12.6
pagka-modernizing
40:14.8
hindi ko nakikita.
40:16.4
Kahit yung mga ayala
40:17.7
pinapackage yung sarili nila
40:21.7
as all the other typhoons.
40:23.3
And also avoid it.
40:24.1
Kaya, wala akong nakikita
40:28.4
yung elites din natin
40:31.8
in new directions.
40:33.0
conservative din.
40:35.2
Kahit yung pagpapayaman nila,
40:37.4
napaka-conservative
40:38.3
ng pagpapayaman nila.
40:44.1
mag-grow yung economy.
40:46.4
Upward-looking talaga
40:47.3
para dumami talaga
40:49.1
yung trabaho dito
40:50.6
yung foreign exchange.
40:52.0
Hindi sila ganun.
40:57.6
Yung mga magkakapatid.
41:00.0
grabe ang regulatory
41:02.9
Talagang sila ngayon
41:05.3
ng regulatory capture
41:06.6
lalo na sa energy.
41:08.3
At pumapasok pa sila
41:11.2
Wala akong makita eh.
41:16.4
a section of the elites.
41:20.4
Yun yung magiging
41:23.1
What about si Martin?
41:26.1
he's quite smart.
41:27.2
I heard good things about him
41:28.2
when he was in Cornell
41:33.4
nandun din daw ulit.
41:34.9
Nasa Cornell din.
41:36.9
Harvard Tagalog program
41:39.6
So, I don't know.
41:40.3
Maybe he's the guy.
41:47.9
tumawa ka lang ah.
41:50.2
yung mga nakapaligid.
41:50.8
Baka may plano ka sa Congress ah.
41:52.5
Yung mga nakapaligid
41:54.2
leaves much to be desired.
42:00.7
political allies are
42:02.3
and I'll tell you
42:05.3
kinakailangan niyang
42:08.8
yung head ng kanyang
42:15.5
So, yun yung magiging
42:19.8
Hindi siya makaalis eh.
42:24.9
kundi yung kanyang
42:30.0
and not-too-clean
42:33.9
So, in that sense,
42:35.1
Guibo is a bit more removed,
42:36.4
more of a sovereign mind,
42:38.1
more of a potential
42:43.1
he's an individual.
42:44.9
Not a political party,
42:47.9
or not even a section
42:50.7
Very interesting.
42:52.4
last point to close
42:53.5
this third episode
42:59.9
ang dami kong naisip bigla.
43:01.2
I'm gonna write that down.
43:02.5
I really appreciated this.
43:03.8
I really didn't see Guibo.
43:06.2
but you're absolutely right,
43:09.7
Your guy from the 1950s.
43:11.4
Very interesting.
43:13.7
Tinatanong ko lang.
43:14.6
Wala akong exposure
43:24.3
ang sinasabi about him.
43:30.0
Kaya ako nagtatanong.
43:33.9
alam ko as a debater,
43:36.3
impressive debaters
43:39.7
yun lang alam ko.
43:41.2
And ikaw, Ronald,
43:42.5
to close this episode.
43:46.0
this episode was supposed
43:59.6
Do you think that
44:02.1
marginalizing Duterte's,
44:03.5
bringing some sanity
44:05.5
this could at least
44:06.1
create the breathing space
44:07.3
for a revitalized opposition?
44:17.1
style of approach.
44:18.4
medyo maayos-ayos
44:23.3
far left will go to the center.
44:25.5
you never know, right?
44:27.3
if there's gonna be
44:28.0
some positive take on
44:29.4
Marcos Jr.'s legacy,
44:31.3
which was this episode,
44:40.1
negative about him,
44:49.6
hindi na mangyayari yan.
44:51.6
Ang problema nga ay
44:53.0
yung iba sinasabi,
44:56.9
katulad siya ng father
44:58.3
who is very decisive,
45:04.5
sana may kaunti siyang ganon
45:06.5
to resolve itong mga
45:08.5
ganitong klaseng mga away,
45:12.8
katulad na sinabi ko kanina,
45:19.2
is hindi ganong kaklaro
45:21.3
anong gagawin niya sa economy.
45:26.1
kaunting indicative
45:31.9
maliban sa Maharlika,
45:34.1
na hanggang ngayon
45:34.8
hindi ko maunawaan
45:36.4
itong Maharlika na ito.
45:39.8
Kasi wala nang iba.
45:42.9
in his first six months,
45:43.9
alam natin what he wants to happen.
45:46.1
We didn't agree with him.
45:47.3
But you know what?
45:50.8
alam natin anong mangyari
45:53.2
But magtotwo years na ito,
45:55.6
hindi ko pa rin alam eh.
45:56.7
Ano ba talaga ito?
45:58.2
clean up, clean up?
46:03.8
ang strength naman ito,
46:05.9
meron kang political space eh.
46:07.9
Lalo na pag natabi
46:09.5
itong mga reactionary Duterte.
46:17.1
yung kanyang foreign policy.
46:19.0
Ganito ka-positive
46:22.5
compared to his predecessor,
46:24.3
yung respect for civil liberties
46:25.9
and human rights.
46:32.0
masyadong malaki yung difference
46:43.7
Hindi ko nakikita
46:47.4
Malimpan doon sa pinagmamalaki niya
46:48.9
itong 90 billion dollars
46:54.3
hindi na bebenta yan eh.
46:55.4
Nagawa niya ni Digong yan eh.
46:58.3
pledge-pledge lang,
46:59.7
pledge-pledge diplomacy.
47:01.3
Thank you so much,
47:04.3
babalik tayo kay Marcos.
47:13.9
say what you will about Duterte,
47:15.4
sabi ni Charmaine Ramos,
47:17.0
gumawa siya ng pag-aaral,
47:19.6
had the highest levels
47:20.9
of social spending
47:22.1
as compared to any other
47:23.6
post-ed sa president.
47:26.0
susukatin si BBM,
47:27.7
dapat sukatin si BBM dyan,
47:29.5
gano'n kataas ba yung
47:30.2
social spending mo
47:31.0
as a percentage of your budget?
47:32.6
Hindi ko pa alam yung sagot
47:34.7
too early on to see pa yung
47:36.1
overall projection
47:37.3
ng spending arc nila.
47:39.2
kung hindi man mag-improve,
47:41.7
wag man lang sana mag-retrogress.
47:43.7
Kasi kung smaller ang
47:44.8
social spending mo
47:47.0
edi you're no worse
47:49.5
than the mass murderer
47:51.8
that would be really different.
47:52.5
Pero ang problema lalo
47:58.4
yung minanay niya.
48:00.9
Magagawa ni Digong
48:03.5
save ni Pinoy eh.
48:05.4
nag-iwan kami almost
48:07.6
Thanks to Aquino.
48:11.7
Not to say the least
48:12.5
nung pumunta siya.
48:16.5
medyo hirap siya eh.
48:18.7
wala siyang pang-ayuda.
48:22.2
ang daming pang-ayuda eh.
48:23.9
Ang daming niyang
48:25.1
sa social spending.
48:27.6
record high debts.
48:33.8
ang credit rating natin.
48:44.2
naniniwala pa rin
48:46.3
ng konting puwang
48:47.2
ang third world countries
48:49.0
after the COVID pandemic.
48:52.6
I was supposed to attend
48:53.8
kaso nag-overtime tayo.
48:55.7
I was supposed to attend
48:57.3
ang finance minister
48:58.2
ng Indonesia sa amin ngayon.
49:01.5
papanuri ko dapat.
49:03.2
sabi niya talaga,
49:04.0
ang sabi ng direction talaga,
49:05.5
ang theme ng talk niya
49:09.0
over monetary policy
49:10.5
for the third world.
49:11.4
So, naniniwala siya
49:12.6
na wala nang room
49:13.9
for monetary policy,
49:16.1
for monetary policy
49:17.5
for the third world ngayon.
49:20.0
ang pang-jumpstart natin
49:21.5
ay fiscal policy.
49:27.0
indicative to of yung mood
49:28.3
sa Southeast Asia.
49:29.8
Kung gano'n na mag-isip
49:30.6
ang finance minister
49:33.8
pwede pa rin sakyan
49:37.4
pwede siyang ano,
49:38.5
sabihin na natin,
49:40.1
compared to Duterte.
49:40.9
Huwag lang sobrang
49:42.0
mag-collapse yung
49:45.3
he can even afford that
49:46.5
with food inflation already
49:47.8
dipping into his popularity,
49:50.4
conditional cash transfers
49:51.8
and other kind of measures.
49:54.0
sabihin na natin.
49:54.4
I don't think he can
49:55.2
even afford it politically.
49:57.9
bumagsak ng konti.
49:59.8
huwag lang mag-creter.
50:01.6
And I'd like our economy
50:03.3
siguro to start studying
50:04.8
na yung spending patterns
50:12.4
spent on social spending
50:13.7
ang pinag-uusapan natin,
50:18.0
sa social services.
50:20.7
yung overall pie.
50:25.5
yung mga positive elements
50:28.3
yung isang element naman
50:29.6
ng ating global economy
50:31.5
it's very competitive.
50:33.7
Lalo na sa ating region.
50:37.1
in the past few decades,
50:42.9
in the labor market.
50:45.6
Itong next decade,
50:48.7
with our deteriorating
50:51.3
educational system,
50:52.6
at yung scaling up
51:01.0
they will give us
51:02.3
a run for our money.
51:03.5
Example lang yun,
51:06.3
Baka yung call center natin
51:11.1
one of our few strengths.
51:13.0
We had a whole episode
51:15.9
that's my point, Ronald.
51:19.1
all we're seeing right now
51:20.3
is a war of position
51:25.9
to make the big decisions.
51:28.8
mahirap magbig decision
51:29.9
kung the Dutertes
51:31.3
are breathing down your neck.
51:32.8
Mahirap magposition
51:33.5
kung hindi pa klaro
51:34.6
saan yung foreign policy natin
51:35.9
sinong aliado natin.
51:37.8
ito yung optimistic scenario.
51:40.4
But the optimistic scenario
51:41.3
is that the first 2-3 years
51:42.6
of BBM is cleaning up the house
51:44.1
and then he's gonna use
51:46.6
for big, big moves
51:48.1
that could surprise us.
51:49.3
That's the cautiously optimistic one.
51:51.2
Where it's gonna happen,
51:52.6
But at least we discussed
51:54.5
even if hindi yung left
51:56.5
or populist takes over,
51:58.3
if a bunch of more
51:59.3
modernizing elite
52:00.5
within the BBM posh people
52:04.2
hindi na sustainable
52:09.7
but siguro 4 out of 10
52:11.5
some interesting moves
52:13.6
and trade policy, etc.
52:15.8
that's how I read it, Ronald.
52:17.6
That's also how I hope
52:19.6
because the alternative is
52:21.0
kick the can down the road,
52:23.6
and in 5 years right now,
52:25.9
kakainin tayo ng mga kapitbayan natin,
52:27.6
kakainin tayo ng artificial intelligence
52:29.4
at kakainin tayo ng all sorts of
52:31.2
internal problems
52:32.3
na hindi na-resolve.
52:33.5
And nakakatakot yung ganyan scenario.
52:35.9
nudge the administration
52:37.4
because I know there's some people
52:39.7
Wall Street people
52:40.5
listening to us sometimes.
52:41.8
You never know, Ronald.
52:42.8
I hope they're listening to us
52:44.2
because our analysis
52:45.6
is hindi sustainable
52:47.5
It's time to make some big moves.
52:49.3
So, I'm just hoping
52:50.0
war of position pa rin tayo.
52:51.7
Then we go to the war of maneuver.
52:58.5
That's how I put it.
53:00.1
Ang problema nitong
53:01.6
one and a half years
53:06.8
he makes decision
53:09.7
making a decision.
53:13.4
yun yung nangyayari.
53:16.0
kailangan magbago yun.
53:21.4
Thank you so much, guys.
53:22.9
Nagka-crash na lahat
53:28.6
Two and a half hours
53:31.9
I mean, it just shows.
53:32.4
I prefer you guys
53:33.5
to the finance minister
53:35.7
Leloy, don't worry.
53:36.6
You won't regret it.
53:39.6
to seeing the outline
53:40.5
because thanks to you.
53:42.2
Because for a long year,
53:43.9
the Berkeley boys,
53:45.4
new liberal Berkeley boys
53:47.3
Indonesia's economic policy.
53:50.0
The whole so-happiness.
53:51.8
ng libro ni Leloy?
53:53.2
Hindi ko nga alam
53:53.7
na may libro sa Leloy.
53:54.6
Send mo na yung ano
53:55.6
pa-review mo niya
53:57.7
Napadala ko sa inyo.
53:58.7
Hindi pa lumalabas.
54:00.3
Napadala ko sa inyo.
54:05.5
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
54:06.6
Nabasa mo, di ba?
54:08.1
I really appreciate it.
54:09.6
Isang takeaway ko dito
54:10.6
sa ating session.
54:12.5
Thank you so much, guys.
54:13.6
I really appreciate it.
54:15.1
I think the first
54:15.9
RRL series of episodes,
54:18.6
chinup-chup natin
54:19.4
para Ilocano style.
54:21.5
Squeeze out, squeeze out.
54:23.8
The responses were super good.
54:25.7
Ang gagaling pa nga
54:26.5
mga nakakomment dito.
54:27.8
Talagang kung ano
54:31.0
we are engaging people
54:32.1
even if it's 2 a.m.
54:33.3
almost in the Philippines.
54:34.7
thank you so much.
54:36.8
Mas madal-dal ka pa sa akin.
54:39.8
Hindi masyado ito, right?
54:42.9
Para kang Isabelo
54:44.0
de los Reyes pala.
54:45.2
You have so much energy,
54:46.4
it can electrify the world, right?
54:48.8
Gusto kong makulong
54:56.6
And thank you so much, Leloy.
54:59.0
a little bit of your energy
54:59.9
and time in the morning
55:00.7
but I hope we made it
55:05.3
Tagal ko ng pangarap.
55:08.0
Finally, we made it happen.
