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00:00.2
Okay, okay. Bago natin pag-usapan ng Smartmatic.
00:03.8
Favorite ni Ronaldo yan. Smartmatic.
00:06.0
Na-ban na yata. Hindi na pwede sa mga next elections.
00:08.2
Pag-usapan natin itong issue ng ICC
00:09.8
because we ended on Harry Roque,
00:12.1
favorite lawyer in the world of Mark Gamboa.
00:18.0
So, obviously, he's a fine legal mind.
00:22.3
I'll give that to him.
00:23.4
Ibang usapan na yung convictions and all of that.
00:27.1
And the thing is, he has embodied that.
00:29.6
So, I agree with you na he will be still the guy at the very front
00:33.0
making a strong argument, the articulate point.
00:36.5
As a staff person, siyempre iba yung pag-support eh.
00:39.6
Oo, iba yung political support.
00:41.7
Now, the issue of ICC obviously is back again.
00:45.5
And I think this is where I and Ronald had slight disagreements.
00:47.7
I think overall, Ronald,
00:49.4
that the Tamba Los Los episode really opened a whole downward spiral,
00:57.4
if not a rabbit hole.
00:58.4
I think tama pa rin si Ronald.
01:00.3
My point though is,
01:01.9
ang reading ko kay BBM is he's more open right now to the ICC coming back than not.
01:07.4
First, ikaw, Mark, anong baso mo sa ICC issue?
01:09.4
Nagpa-panic mode na ba?
01:10.4
Kasi kung titingnan mo yung mga statements ni Sarah,
01:12.7
yung mannerism niya, the way she was interviewed,
01:15.1
parang medyo kabado eh, di ba?
01:17.6
Sinasabi niya, hindi, kausapin namin ng DOJ.
01:21.3
It doesn't show confidence and strength.
01:23.9
She doesn't look suave like her dad, di ba?
01:26.1
Yung father niya, under all kinds of pressure.
01:28.4
Suave pa rin eh, defiant eh.
01:33.7
Mukhang tutuloyan talaga.
01:35.5
Yun ang aking assessment sa ngayon.
01:38.7
Mukhang doon talaga tayo papunta.
01:40.4
Yung ICC will be,
01:43.3
yung the government will cooperate with ICC.
01:46.1
They will come here, they will investigate,
01:47.9
and we will see what happens kapag they start investigating here.
01:53.1
Noong huli nating vlog na magkakasama,
01:55.7
di ba ang tanong is kung yung sa Unity ba,
01:58.4
parang I was thinking at that time na pwede pang masalba
02:03.7
or maayos pa yung dalawa.
02:05.5
Di ba? I was on that side eh, na parang okay.
02:08.1
Ngayon, hindi na.
02:10.6
And Ronald Llamas, school of thought ka na.
02:13.8
Kasi to be honest, ako rin medyo 50-50 ako noon.
02:16.5
I think you and Mark, you and I were more on the side na
02:19.0
huwag natin na underestimate, no?
02:20.8
The shared interest of these two parties.
02:22.5
Ronald was, in fairness to you, di ba?
02:24.1
Si, mahal na mahal kita Ronald, I'm fair to you.
02:26.9
You were the more na hindi eh.
02:28.4
Shots have been fired, medyo lines have been crossed eh.
02:31.3
And remember guys, yung last time yung nag-usap tayo,
02:33.9
we were talking about the Lima being freed, di ba?
02:36.3
As one of the indicators,
02:38.0
now we're crossing the line into the all-out war na.
02:40.7
And that has happened.
02:41.8
Since last time we talked, di ba?
02:43.3
Remember yung isang mention natin,
02:44.9
the Lima would be one of the indicators
02:46.9
na we're moving towards all-out civil war.
02:49.8
So we're there already.
02:51.0
The Lima is out, right?
02:51.9
So Mark, now you're saying,
02:54.3
mukhang convinced ka na na
02:58.4
And siguro isang malaking factor din dyan,
03:03.6
yung pagdalao ko sa kongreso.
03:06.6
Nakita mo na talaga na eto na talaga.
03:12.6
Yung mga congressman na kaalyado ni Pangulong Duterte
03:16.9
for how many years,
03:19.9
it took them less than one year, one and a half years.
03:24.4
They're totally on the other side na
03:26.6
and they're pulling.
03:28.4
pushing through with this ICC.
03:32.0
I come from vlogging.
03:34.3
Kaya nakikita ko yung lakas
03:38.6
gano'n sila mambully,
03:41.2
Kaso wala naman pakialam
03:42.9
yung sa Congress.
03:45.6
tatanggalin nyo kami
03:46.4
sa mga local positions namin.
03:51.0
ang magandang lesson dito
03:52.8
para sa mga DDS din,
03:58.4
mas naiintindihan nila
04:00.3
ng mga congressman
04:01.4
in electing congressman
04:04.8
the same values with you.
04:13.1
o ano ng governor
04:14.0
o maraming tinutulong sa amin.
04:17.8
na sinasabi ko sa PINCS.
04:19.5
That they should elect
04:20.3
congressman party list
04:22.0
na align sa values nila
04:23.9
para pag nagkakaroon
04:24.9
ng mga ganitong problema.
04:30.0
if a congressman gets elected
04:33.7
he will remain DDS
04:36.7
Hindi katulad nung ganyan na
04:40.3
lahat nasa kabilang side na.
04:44.5
pero ngayon mukhang tutuloyan talaga.
04:46.1
Mukhang the ICC is,
04:48.0
the government will cooperate
04:51.0
Mukhang doon talaga papunta.
04:52.4
Magalit na yung magalit.
04:57.1
Ronald, I'll go back to you.
04:58.9
I did a poll on Twitter.
05:00.0
Of course, it's not scientific,
05:01.3
but more scientific
05:02.2
than Google Trends, maybe.
05:04.0
nagtanong ako ng option na apat,
05:07.9
anong gagawin ni Marcus Jr.
05:12.3
Pubuksan niya ng pinto.
05:14.0
The other one was,
05:15.9
ninegotiate pa yan.
05:17.8
yung pinakakumuha ng boto is,
05:21.2
as leverage point pa rin
05:22.9
to squeeze and whip
05:25.5
but not necessarily
05:28.0
many people are still skeptical
05:29.3
that BBM will go all-in
05:34.4
they'll allow slowly and slowly
05:36.7
yung mga mid-ranking
05:39.1
yung just below Duterte level
05:43.0
Dun sa last year's election.
05:44.7
And I want to mention this,
05:46.3
favorite din natin na senador yan,
05:50.2
kay Riza Antiveros.
05:51.3
Very emotional siya,
05:52.8
Nung si Riza Antiveros
05:54.2
push for that resolution,
05:57.7
for the ICC talaga,
05:59.4
na maging bukas na tayo sa ICC.
06:01.4
what is your read
06:01.9
on all of these things?
06:04.6
Several months ago,
06:05.8
the decision has been made.
06:08.7
Several months ago pa.
06:09.9
Iba yung mga public posturing.
06:11.7
Alam mo naman yung public posturing na yan eh.
06:14.2
Iba yung drama eh.
06:15.3
Again, fog of war lang.
06:17.0
The hard decision has been made
06:18.7
several months ago.
06:24.6
Hindi ko na sasabihin
06:25.7
Ang nangyari na yan
06:27.6
several months ago.
06:27.9
Yan ang gusto mo sa'yo,
06:30.8
Hindi yan nangyari.
06:31.9
Today, last week,
06:34.3
several months ago.
06:35.8
Tapos na yung decision.
06:37.2
Ang nakikita natin
06:41.5
ay pag-aaralan na namin.
06:44.1
Sobrang malaking talon
06:45.5
mula dun sa position nila
06:47.1
at the start of the year.
06:48.9
We are totally close
06:51.7
to enter the country.
06:55.7
Pero even months before that,
06:58.1
the decision has been made,
06:59.7
papapasukin ang ICC.
07:01.4
Nagsimula yan last year pa eh
07:03.1
nung nadiskubre yung plot
07:05.0
to oust the Speaker.
07:07.8
Ang problema naman dito
07:10.8
Sinulap nila sa papel,
07:15.1
at dalawang senador.
07:17.7
sa ating uri ng politika,
07:19.7
walang permanent friends
07:21.0
and permanent enemies.
07:22.6
Only permanent interest.
07:25.7
Nag-report sa speaker
07:30.1
Partly nangyari sa Korea,
07:31.9
partly nangyari dito.
07:34.8
Daladala yung papel
07:38.0
pinaabot sa presidente.
07:40.0
Kaya as early as before
07:42.6
the lines have been drawn.
07:45.3
Kahit hindi natin nakikita.
07:46.8
Tapos nangyari yung Tambalus Laws.
07:49.3
Nangyari yung Tambalus Laws
07:51.4
itong plot na ito.
07:53.4
Nakuni ng speakership
07:55.5
i-blackmail yung presidente
07:59.5
Doon sa political agenda
08:01.3
at political narrative
08:03.2
nung two plotters.
08:04.4
Kaya anong statement ni
08:05.5
ano statement ni speaker?
08:08.0
We nip in the bad
08:10.9
against the speaker.
08:11.7
We nip in the bad
08:12.8
a destabilization plot.
08:14.7
Hindi sa atin nanggaling yun
08:21.6
Tumabas na yan, no?
08:22.7
Kaya doon nagsimula.
08:25.3
nag-deteriorate na.
08:29.0
dito sa nilabas ni Browner
08:31.4
at saka destabilization plots
08:35.3
at saka recruitment.
08:37.5
Na alam naman natin
08:38.5
when there is smoke,
08:40.2
there is usually fire.
08:43.2
At mismo yung statement ni
08:47.2
civil disobedience,
08:48.8
the most rattled institution,
08:50.9
Beware of the police
08:52.0
and the military.
08:53.4
They're plotting something.
08:54.8
At mismo yung statement ni
08:55.3
nangyari na yan eh,
08:57.1
Pero behind the scenes,
08:58.7
ito yung mga nangyayari.
09:00.3
Na-expose yung plot
09:01.5
as early as last year.
09:07.3
Para hawakan yung
09:12.5
Pero hindi na-expose
09:14.0
yung hard decision
09:16.1
the ICC to enter.
09:19.8
gagamitin yung ICC
09:24.3
sila na mag-ayos.
09:26.0
Tapos na yun, no?
09:31.4
The lines have been broke,
09:34.3
very clear na yun,
09:36.1
Very clear na yun
09:37.0
na papasok na yung ICC.
09:39.3
At dapat mangyari yan
09:45.6
yung new opposition
09:52.3
Ano kung babasahin
10:00.8
Yun yung problema
10:04.2
Yung smoking gun,
10:06.9
ng Dabao Death Squad
10:10.7
Who literally knows
10:11.8
where the skeletons
10:18.3
in-specify ni Lascanias
10:32.7
na hawak ni Michael
10:36.5
Naka-specify yun.
10:39.0
the tip of the iceberg.
10:40.2
Mahaba yung testimony
10:55.1
panic mode na to,
10:56.8
panic mode na to,
11:02.6
baka naman panic mode na ito,
11:04.0
hindi lang ito hubris,
11:07.3
talagang desperate
11:08.5
panic mode na to.
11:09.5
Dahil sa Vera Files,
11:12.1
Dahil sa Vera Files,
11:34.3
dahil ang tatamaan dito,
11:35.5
hindi lang si Dico.
11:39.2
buong rehymen yan,
11:43.7
na ang kulin nilang
11:50.3
isa sa nagkampanyahan
11:51.5
na tayo ay maging
11:55.4
Tama lang na siya
12:00.3
siya yung nagsasabi,
12:01.3
huwag i-vote si Dico.
12:02.8
Mamamatay tao yan.
12:08.3
mamamatay tao yan.
12:21.6
as mamamatay tao.
12:34.2
for his principles?
12:36.9
para sa kanyang katanguhan?
12:38.7
Ibang usapin yan.
12:40.3
Ibang usapin ngayon.
12:42.1
Pag binanata niya
12:55.8
gender neutral tayo.
13:01.4
I'm just clarifying,
13:04.4
ay si Harry Rockett
13:11.5
anong sabi mo diyan
13:14.1
I have a question
13:24.0
How do you explain
13:24.8
to an ordinary Filipino
13:27.7
sabihin natin yung mga
13:28.6
gusto si Duterte,
13:32.8
needs to be a part
13:39.0
Ronald, by the way,
13:43.1
Ako, Diyos ko po.
13:46.9
there's always a back up.
13:49.1
si Atty. Topacio,
13:50.5
nakakasabay ko yan
13:53.5
hindi na bibitawan.
13:55.2
mas magaling siya
13:56.6
Parang may mga kilala
14:00.7
sasamahan ko siya
14:03.1
pero hindi ko siya
14:03.7
kukuling abugado ko.
14:07.7
marami akong maisip
14:09.9
ganyan tipong tao.
14:11.5
Marami na makapatayan
14:14.6
tapos wala sa tono.
14:17.9
yung Frank Sinatra,
14:19.9
That's the most dangerous
14:21.9
Yung tanong ni Mark.
14:23.1
Yung tanong ni Mark.
14:25.6
Kasagot na ni Ronald.
14:35.4
More than 30,000.
14:39.0
Nagamitin ko mismo
14:39.8
yung sinabi ni Digong
14:45.5
ang point kasi ni Mark
14:47.3
ano ang mabag ng ICC?
14:50.1
isang ordinaryong tao
14:51.1
na ano ba itong ICC,
14:52.7
Ang point ko naman,
14:54.8
huwag natin kalimutan
14:55.7
na kailangan natin
14:57.7
yung international community.
14:58.9
Kaya ginagamit natin
14:59.8
yung arbitration case
15:00.8
sa West Philippine Sea,
15:03.1
dapat magpakita tayo
15:04.1
na isa tayong responsable,
15:06.8
international community.
15:08.4
you cannot play it both ways.
15:11.0
ayaw namin sa ICC
15:13.0
ay, tulungan niyo ako
15:13.8
sa West Philippine Sea
15:14.5
kasi binubuli ako ng China.
15:16.2
isa sa pwede mong isipin yan.
15:18.7
huwag natin kalimutan
15:19.6
na hindi po absolute
15:21.7
ng isang gobyerno.
15:24.6
hindi ibig sabihin,
15:25.3
binoto ako ng tao,
15:26.9
kung anong gusto ko sa inyo,
15:28.8
Ang ibig sabihin diyan,
15:29.9
may multiple levels
15:30.9
of accountability.
15:31.9
Kung sakali lang,
15:34.3
justice system natin
15:35.9
dahil takot sa presidente,
15:38.5
kalokohan nangyari,
15:40.3
at least yung ICC,
15:41.2
parang caution yan,
15:42.3
parang backup yan.
15:43.3
Kaya nga yun yung principle
15:44.5
of complementarity.
15:45.9
Kung nag-fail yung
15:46.7
domestic institutions,
15:49.0
dahil politically blocked,
15:51.0
diyan pwede pumasok
15:53.9
may nanalong kandidato
15:55.2
na galing sa kabila,
15:57.2
at biglang pinapatay kayo
15:58.5
or may ginagawang kalokohan,
16:00.2
at least mayroong kang
16:02.4
mayroong kang SOS.
16:03.9
think of ICC also
16:06.9
kung compromise na talaga
16:08.3
yung domestic institutions.
16:09.0
Kung compromise yung justice system.
16:11.1
Kasi sabi nung iba nila,
16:13.3
matakbo naman daw
16:15.0
yung ating justice system.
16:16.9
Yun yung madaling,
16:18.1
yun yung mark yung madaling
16:19.6
Pero mark, di ba?
16:24.4
Nga na-convict lang,
16:27.7
Medyo malayo, di ba?
16:29.6
So, yung mga pamilya,
16:32.3
nung more than 30,000
16:34.1
ang recourse lang nila
16:38.4
hindi sila makapag-
16:40.8
dito sa Pilipinas
16:48.7
out of 30,000 EJ case,
16:56.2
nila nakuha dyan eh,
17:07.9
mag-cherry picking.
17:09.7
Kung pipiliin natin
17:17.7
hindi pwede mag-cherry picking.
17:18.9
Hihina yung ating
17:28.0
behind the scenes,
17:28.8
may pressure from our allies,
17:30.2
yung European Union,
17:31.6
sinasabi kay BBM,
17:37.2
ng tulong sa amin
17:38.0
sa international law,
17:39.2
West Philippines,
17:40.1
kung ang tingin sa bansa nyo
17:42.9
Hindi mo ba nakita,
17:46.6
biglang na-aproobahan
17:47.6
yung ating GSP Plus
17:52.0
products ng Pilipinas
17:54.4
na hindi bibigyan
17:59.3
behind the scenes,
18:00.6
may mga nangyari,
18:02.3
kaya nga feeling ko,
18:04.0
isang reason na si BBM
18:05.5
ay medyo kampante
18:07.9
is because may backing siya
18:12.9
andun yung China,
18:14.8
mas marami pang nagbaback
18:17.3
at malalaking bansa.
18:19.4
isa pang hindi natin
18:20.5
is yung presidents.
18:22.6
kung pumasok ang ICC
18:24.2
dito sa Asia na ito,
18:26.8
hindi mo pwede isipin na,
18:28.6
utos ng presidente,
18:30.4
sunod na rin tayo sa kanya.
18:32.8
kung mawala yung presidente
18:35.2
that sends a very strong signal
18:44.4
Hindi sa mga politiko.
18:46.1
once na wala na yung mga politiko,
18:47.8
hindi na kayo maprotektahan
18:49.0
yung papasok ng ICC.
18:50.7
You get what I'm saying?
18:51.6
ito yung tinatawag na
18:52.3
shadow of the future.
18:57.3
sa kalukuan ngayon.
18:59.6
ngayon lang may protection ka,
19:01.7
pero lagot ka down the road.
19:04.5
you're gonna rethink that.
19:05.6
So, this is about president.
19:07.0
I wanna add another thing.
19:08.5
This is also about
19:09.4
ICC's own credibility.
19:12.0
if there's one thing I agree
19:13.1
with the DDS camp is,
19:14.5
itong ICC niya yan,
19:15.8
puro mga African leaders lang
19:17.4
ang target so far
19:19.0
at Eastern Europe at most.
19:21.8
doon sa Ukraine issue,
19:23.0
wala pang isang taon
19:23.9
meron ng warrant of arrest
19:25.7
So, sinasabi ng iba,
19:28.0
pag malapit sa Europe
19:29.6
ang bilis gumalaw.
19:30.9
Pero, pag sa ibang lugar,
19:34.4
mahalaga din for ICC
19:36.6
that they don't have
19:37.6
institutional bias
19:38.6
and that they have
19:40.6
And yung favorite word natin,
19:42.8
to go against leaders
19:44.5
from faraway regions
19:46.2
like Southeast Asia.
19:47.8
So, a lot is also
19:48.7
at stake for ICC here,
19:52.3
I think ang best na interview
19:53.7
na pwede mo i-check
19:54.3
yung interviews namin
19:55.2
ni Atty. Carranza.
19:59.6
on human rights issues
20:01.8
in different parts of the world.
20:03.4
So, pakicheck yan.
20:04.8
sinag-usapan natin
20:05.5
namin ng masinsinan
20:07.1
and geopolitical perspective
20:10.0
itong kaso ng Pilipinas.
20:12.3
this is big deal, Mark.
20:13.8
This is very big deal.
20:14.9
Kaya, behind the scenes,
20:16.9
yung aliado natin,
20:19.7
medyo kailangan mong
20:20.6
gumalaw na dyan sa ICC.
20:21.9
So, that's why I think
20:22.7
lumalambot din ito
20:28.2
ng mga aliado natin
20:29.2
ng Western countries.
20:30.5
sila din ang kailangan natin
20:31.6
later on sa Western countries.
20:33.9
the DOJ right now,
20:35.9
supplementary arbitration
20:44.6
pakiang China dito
20:45.7
sa mga karagatan natin.
20:47.2
Na yung 9-9 nila,
20:49.6
one thing we didn't do,
20:50.6
and you can check yung interview natin
20:51.7
with Justice Carpio,
20:53.3
hindi natin sila kinasuhan
20:54.8
dun sa mga pagbabuli
20:57.1
at yung mga sinira nilang karagatan.
20:59.6
ang pwede natin gawin
21:00.4
is kakasuhan na natin
21:02.1
at hinihingi tayo ng damages.
21:04.5
this is the next step
21:05.4
na mas mahalaga pa
21:09.8
paano mo naman gagawin yan
21:11.0
kung at the same time,
21:12.9
pagdating sa human rights
21:14.8
wag kayong makailang.
21:16.1
pwede rin sabi ng China,
21:17.2
wag kayong makailang.
21:18.6
This is a sovereign issue.
21:19.9
Do you get what I'm saying?
21:21.2
may dissonance dyan.
21:23.5
even if you don't care
21:24.6
for human rights,
21:25.3
if you care about
21:27.2
you have to care also
21:27.9
about what's happening
21:28.6
kasi connected yan eh.
21:29.8
And that's where I kind of
21:30.6
disagree with Justice Carpio
21:33.9
They're two separate issues.
21:35.3
They're two separate technically,
21:37.3
but geopolitically,
21:38.3
they're more or less the same.
21:40.1
the national rule of law.
21:42.1
yun yung disagreement ko
21:42.9
with Justice Carpio
21:44.7
dun sa aming interview.
21:46.6
salamat sa iyo, Mark,
21:47.4
kasi gusto ko yung mga
21:49.0
because it brings you down
21:50.7
to the essential,
21:54.5
pero dapat nakaka-relate tayo.
21:56.2
si Justice Sereno
21:57.2
na nakausap ko before,
22:01.5
and civil liberties
22:07.2
Kasi ang human rights
22:08.4
ay parang ganito.
22:09.7
May pasaway kang kapatid,
22:12.0
pinapagalitan ko parate
22:13.4
kasi walang due process.
22:16.1
dahil ikaw yung black sheep,
22:17.2
ikaw yung sisisiin ko
22:18.2
pag may nangyaring
22:22.2
because hindi kita
22:23.2
binigyan ng panahon
22:27.1
ako yung pasaway,
22:27.8
ako na naman sisisiin mo.
22:29.0
Ang sama ng loobo.
22:30.9
you have to make it like that.
22:34.0
So, I think this is
22:34.7
the challenge for us.
22:36.6
mahal na mahal ko
22:37.1
itong mga ginagawa natin
22:38.2
because nasa challenge din ako.
22:40.0
Paano ko i-explain ito?
22:44.6
Para ma-explain ko
22:45.4
sa ating kapit-pahay,
22:48.7
So, we're getting there.
22:49.6
Kaya salamat talaga, Mark,
22:50.7
dito sa efforts mo, no?
22:51.9
To make these issues
22:53.0
digestible and relatable
22:54.3
because mahalaga ito.
22:56.3
hindi naman tayo man-heat.
22:57.8
mahalaga yung issue
23:02.4
also there to make sure
23:03.6
na porkit ikaw may reputation,
23:05.9
hindi ikaw ang sisisingin sa lahat.
23:07.4
Or porkit ikaw hindi mayaman
23:09.5
o hindi maraming mag-English,
23:10.6
hindi ka lang ma-EJK
23:12.8
May konting accountability,
23:14.2
may konting predictability
23:16.8
And life expectancy.
23:17.9
Yun lang talagang issue dito.
23:19.1
Kaya, salamat, Mark,
23:20.2
sa mga vloggers na katulad.
23:24.4
hindi pa rin natin
23:25.5
yung elephant in the room.
23:28.3
Hindi pa rin natin
23:29.5
yung elephant in the room.
23:31.2
Yung love life mo
23:32.1
at talagang yung hugot.
23:40.3
Ang dami naghihintay, eh.
23:44.0
alam mo naman tayo,
23:44.7
hindi tayo mag-basta-basta
23:48.3
may glamour shot.
23:51.9
sa kanya, Richard.
23:53.0
Alright, thank you so much,
23:57.3
Nabalikan natin yung mga...
24:00.5
ang pag-usapan, eh.
24:01.5
Hindi mo ang ganyan.
24:11.5
yung episode na ito
24:12.1
because there's a last episode.
24:13.1
Thank you so much,
24:13.7
Mark, for sticking around.
24:14.8
Gumaganda yung internet mo
24:17.0
kasi kumunting traffic
24:20.6
Ang klaro ng mukha mo.
24:23.0
Oo, medyo may kinalaman
24:25.7
Alright, let's go
24:26.5
to the last episode
