00:30.8
Again, assuming logical siya, it's a big if, I'm just saying,
00:34.5
if assuming logical siya, I would argue that baka ang ginagawa niya dito is
00:38.3
he's threatening hell and he's threatening burning down the house
00:41.7
because his concern is eventually baka yung ICC will come after him
00:46.0
or the news will keep on tightening around him.
00:49.0
Like, what's your read on that, Senator Trillanes?
00:50.7
I mean, in the previous episode, we discussed the man, the moment, his algorithm.
00:56.2
And he said a lot of these things.
00:58.1
Anong basa mo ngayon? Is this a madman theory or madmax lang siya ngayon?
01:02.2
Ang ginagawa niya?
01:03.4
Ako, I agree with your theory.
01:07.5
May scorched earth mindset yan eh si Duterte.
01:10.2
Hindi ito, he will burn the house down just to pursue his own agenda.
01:17.4
I agree na lahat yan pretext yung sinasabi niya si Session.
01:23.7
Kung ano man, against sa People's Initiative.
01:29.1
Lahat yan pretext kasi ang ultimate agenda is
01:34.3
gusto niya mag, he wants to play this brinkmanship game with the Marcos administration.
01:41.1
Na tipong, I will burn the house down if you will have me arrested.
01:47.0
So you'll have to talk. Ganun yan.
01:49.4
Exactly, right? Hindi na mas ako eh.
01:51.0
Exactly, hindi na.
01:51.9
Or if yung anak ko,
01:53.4
lalo niyong ganunin,
01:54.6
or yung budget ng Davao,
01:56.0
I mean, you can see what's going on here, right?
01:58.4
Again, I'm assuming he's logical about this in a certain way.
02:04.1
Si Duterte, ano yan?
02:10.8
So may method dun sa madness projection niya.
02:16.2
We have examples.
02:18.6
So pag na-profile mo siya ng maayos,
02:23.4
I-predict mo na yung mga steps niya.
02:25.5
And ito nga yun, itong ginagawa niya.
02:28.5
Gusto niyang i-blackmail o i-hostage itong admin
02:32.3
into getting his way,
02:35.6
which is maiwasan yung ICC arrest niya.
02:40.9
So it's all about that at this point.
02:43.4
Kasi early on, talagang he wanted, ano eh, ako,
02:47.1
ang tingin ko rito,
02:49.6
yung earlier attempts niya to oust Marcos,
02:55.4
this is primarily to protect yung criminal enterprise niya.
02:59.3
Kasi nag-collapse na eh, no?
03:01.2
Michael Yang is twisting in the wind,
03:03.4
nahinto na yung, ano nila,
03:06.8
itong mga polis na part nung sindikato nila
03:09.8
na nalagay na sa freezer
03:11.5
and na dismissed na administratively.
03:13.8
So he needs an insurance, that's what you're arguing.
03:15.9
He needs an insurance.
03:20.7
he never trusted the insurance, right?
03:23.4
ambasted the Marcos,
03:27.1
he was already making insinuations.
03:29.0
And naalala ko dun sa isa sa highlights ng speech niya,
03:31.9
quote-unquote speech niya,
03:35.5
this is the moment I feared,
03:37.2
di ba, yung sinasabi niya, di ba?
03:38.6
So parang sinasabi na,
03:39.6
na-anticipate niya
03:41.9
which I think is a perfect segue to my question right now.
03:44.6
Let's talk about BBM.
03:45.6
Parang Star Wars muna tayo.
03:46.6
I-freeze muna natin itong
03:49.2
itong bardagulan.
03:50.7
Rewind tayo ng konti.
03:52.1
Let's talk about BBM.
03:53.4
What is your read of the situation of BBM?
03:55.1
I mean, of course,
03:56.0
you come from a family of military people.
03:59.9
if you come from military,
04:00.8
baka medyo naintindihan mo yung Marcoses.
04:02.4
Ako, because of my Ilocano background,
04:03.9
I also understand the Marcoses.
04:05.5
So I think both of us were among the few people early on,
04:09.5
na not necessarily perhaps his fan,
04:11.6
but we're always fair.
04:13.9
BBM is not gonna go the gong way.
04:17.2
if he's gonna follow his father,
04:18.8
it's not gonna be in a dictatorial way.
04:20.5
I wanna get your take on BBM.
04:23.0
What is your understanding of BBM's rise to power?
04:26.1
And then this steady,
04:29.1
and now dramatic conflagration
04:31.0
in his unit team with the Dutertas?
04:35.8
pag nakita mo yun,
04:36.9
from the time that,
04:39.9
during his heyday,
04:42.0
nung nag-aaral siya sa Princeton,
04:45.0
may $10,000 allowance siya every month.
04:47.8
he was living a princely lifestyle.
04:56.8
nakasakay kayo sa
04:58.6
nakaupo kayo sa bench sa C-130
05:00.9
flight papuntang Hawaii.
05:03.9
It's a very uncomfortable
05:05.6
trip na imagine mo yung what's going through their minds
05:12.3
pagdating nyo sa Hawaii,
05:14.1
kinompiskate yung mga belongings nyo.
05:17.2
Doon kayo sa isang bungalow.
05:19.6
nilagay siya sa lupa.
05:22.5
And it was a very long journey.
05:24.4
It was a very humbling
05:26.5
experience sa kanila
05:30.3
nanalo siya as Congress,
05:32.1
pero he was never treated seriously
05:34.4
kasi wala na yung father niya.
05:50.4
I wanna ask you more.
05:52.5
ganyan na tayo sa Senate,
05:55.0
I wanna ask you later on.
05:57.4
you're making a very good point.
05:59.2
I'm now working on a book
06:00.5
about the return of Marcus.
06:02.6
something happened there
06:03.6
during the Hawaii years.
06:04.6
I think there was
06:05.0
some sort of soul-searching.
06:07.5
yung tatay niya also
06:09.0
passed away during this time
06:11.1
the Hawaii years.
06:15.4
nakamilitari suit
06:20.6
our good friend si
06:24.7
May training yan,
06:30.6
medyo matapang din,
06:31.6
medyo katulad mo siguro.
06:33.7
something happened during,
06:35.6
he was princeling
06:37.0
all of those things.
06:39.7
nag-overcompensate siya.
06:40.9
He became this hawkish guy.
06:42.7
ang basa ko is exactly
06:45.7
that climbed from,
06:50.0
and then the passing
06:52.2
it did something to him
06:53.3
in terms of soul-searching
06:56.0
immediately return nila
06:57.2
to national politics.
06:58.6
I'm 100% with you.
07:00.0
very similar reading on him.
07:04.3
to the national politics
07:05.9
and pretty smoothly.
07:08.4
a little bit about
07:09.7
encounters with him
07:10.8
when you were colleagues
07:12.8
Pinoy was also there.
07:14.6
Quite an interesting world,
07:18.7
Pinoy pala was the president
07:20.9
Sorry about that.
07:22.2
He was the president.
07:25.6
puntaan ko lang yung
07:26.7
nung panahon ni Pinoy,
07:29.0
they were expecting the worst
07:30.2
kasi tinitignan niya na
07:36.5
Marcos and Aquino's,
07:39.5
nung presidente si Pinoy,
07:41.6
he was expecting the worst.
07:45.7
hindi siya binengahan,
07:47.1
hindi siya binalikan
07:51.6
nagkaroon din ng imprint
07:54.9
even before that,
07:57.9
hindi nila nakita
08:03.8
yung Marcos family,
08:05.2
bumaboto yan sa impeachment
08:10.4
they were with the opposition,
08:12.0
magkakasama rin kami
08:14.5
even nung panahon ni GMA.
08:16.2
So, may gano'n na,
08:19.4
siguro nung rivalry
08:24.7
Pero nung panahon nga ni Pinoy,
08:27.5
low-key lang yan,
08:28.8
si President Marcos,
08:31.3
tama kami sa Nationalista,
08:38.1
may cruise pa kami
08:39.6
Senator Manny Villar,
08:41.2
the party president,
08:42.3
may mga cruise yung
08:43.9
So, may mga gano'ng banding,
08:53.4
Kaming tatlo nila,
08:54.9
we studied the different,
09:03.3
may mga gano'n na,
09:08.1
gusto niyang malaman,
09:10.5
tapos hindi nga siya,
09:15.6
low-key lang siya.
09:19.7
hindi siya binalikan ni Aquino,
09:21.4
ni President Noynoy Aquino,
09:24.5
which he was expecting
09:27.3
makita mo ngayon,
09:32.3
during the Hawaii years,
09:33.4
nalagay sila sa lupa,
09:37.7
nakita niya siguro din na,
09:40.0
na-admit niya yung mga pagkakamali
09:45.6
he wants to prove them wrong,
09:50.4
I can speak for myself,
09:54.4
during the last elections,
09:56.2
we were expecting the worst,
10:00.1
baka pagpatuloy yung
10:01.3
Duterte policies,
10:07.0
alam mo yung trademark na
10:13.5
I was pleasantly surprised,
10:16.0
Na tipong huminto yung
10:19.7
may re-restore yung
10:20.5
democratic institutions,
10:21.4
yung freedom of the media,
10:24.5
freedom of the press,
10:26.2
tapos yung foreign policy,
10:30.1
Doon tayo natuwa sa kanya,
10:31.9
I think that was the biggest
10:33.4
pleasant surprise.
10:41.9
Dati, mga sacred cows ito,
10:46.7
droga ni Duterte yan
10:51.4
naging namayagpag yan,
10:57.8
these are good signs.
10:59.3
18 senior PNP officers
11:02.1
involved sa drugs,
11:06.4
this is a big departure
11:08.6
Duterte policies.
11:33.4
hindi yan perfecto.
11:34.3
Just like any other
11:39.4
but by and large,
11:44.2
important for us,
11:49.5
the democratic space
11:56.7
nagustuhan natin doon.
11:59.6
I agree with you.
12:01.7
I would also add that,
12:05.0
constitutionalist.
12:09.7
around those lines.
12:10.6
I think your comment
12:12.4
not going after him,
12:13.8
leaving a good impression,
12:15.1
siguro reinforcing
12:15.9
his soul-searching.
12:17.9
just like Aquino,
12:19.4
he could be a besieged,
12:22.7
But once he realized
12:23.7
the world is not as crazy
12:26.6
you can have a modus vivendi,
12:29.5
you can live life
12:36.5
We can discuss that
12:37.1
a little bit later
12:39.6
with the Maharlika Fund.
12:40.9
I have concerns with the,
12:44.1
for what happened
12:45.9
dictatorship years.
12:48.2
the counter-argument to that is
12:49.3
he cannot do it openly
12:50.6
may legal exposure,
12:52.0
That's one version I heard.
12:53.7
he cannot ever openly say it
12:55.4
because may expose yung nanay niya,
12:56.6
may expose yung family niya,
12:57.7
they have court cases in the US.
12:59.2
But what you're saying is,
13:03.1
This is his way of,
13:04.8
trying to fix things,
13:09.3
But let's talk about it
13:10.5
now that we're at this
13:11.8
crucial juncture,
13:13.7
the usual criticism,
13:15.9
transparent about it,
13:16.9
I've transmitted it to our
13:19.3
in the government,
13:20.6
may paka-conflict
13:25.9
maybe unfair to say that,
13:27.4
but there are times
13:28.4
that you want him to show
13:31.3
because ang karap mo dito,
13:34.2
We've spent the whole episode
13:35.4
discussing the algorithm
13:37.9
And it looks like
13:38.5
those people are not
13:39.3
gonna go gently into the night.
13:40.8
They're not just gonna accept
13:43.1
in Philippine politics.
13:44.6
total marginalization.
13:46.6
Don't you think that BBM is,
13:48.2
should show a little bit of
13:51.6
not authoritarian,
13:52.2
but he has to be a little bit
13:54.5
maybe you're implying
13:55.5
suabe niya ginagawa
13:57.1
and it's just a matter of time
13:58.3
before the hammer comes down.
13:59.8
Like the Democles sword
14:00.9
is coming slowly down,
14:02.3
but like Kill Bill,
14:04.9
what you're gonna,
14:05.8
what you're implying here?
14:08.5
I don't expect the hammer
14:09.3
to come down like Thor.
14:12.5
hindi mo maririnig yun sa kanya,
14:14.4
but it's going to go down
14:18.2
behind the scenes,
14:20.6
yung circumstances,
14:22.5
basta't hindi mo yun makikita.
14:24.4
in-embrace niya na
14:25.2
itong ganitong brand of
14:32.4
Even sa Senate doon,
14:36.7
I disagree with you,
14:38.3
I think it's love the Philippines.
14:40.0
I think it's more yung
14:41.8
love the Philippines.
14:42.9
Love, love, love.
14:45.3
Ganyan ko na lang.
14:46.0
Basta good vibes.
14:50.6
So, in-embrace niya na yun eh.
14:52.6
But it doesn't mean na
14:54.0
nothing is happening
14:55.7
behind the scenes.
15:00.7
may pinanggagalingan
15:01.7
yung panic niyan.
15:02.8
Yung paranoia niyan.
15:04.6
May nararamdaman niyan.
15:10.2
gusto ko lang balikan
15:11.5
yung punto na yun
15:17.8
then siya eventually.
15:24.0
naging victim sila doon
15:25.2
sa echo chamber effect
15:28.4
highly charged na lahat
15:31.1
talagang meron na silang
15:34.9
that encouraged them
15:36.7
to do what they did.
15:44.1
Kasi, alam namin eh
15:45.1
na may mga pinagalaw silang
15:47.1
mga retired Duterte generals
15:50.1
or been attempting to
15:54.8
the active members
15:56.6
to join the ranks.
15:58.9
May mga na-identify nga
16:01.2
PNP regional directors
16:04.1
sumama na sa kanila.
16:10.1
wala yung ano eh.
16:16.6
ano ng ordinaryong Pilipino,
16:18.1
hindi naramdaman yung
16:23.9
kahit nag-init na init na siya,
16:25.7
but by and large,
16:38.8
si Duterte will not stop
16:43.6
kung magkagulo-gulo man,
16:46.3
he doesn't need to
16:47.4
give it to Sara eh.
16:50.1
Pag nagkagulo-gulo,
16:53.4
bibigay kay Sara?
16:55.5
Pag naupo sila Sara,
16:57.7
di ko lampuri naman
16:58.5
yung mga tao nila eh.
17:00.9
iba yung click ni Sara.
17:09.7
hawkish nature ba
17:12.4
BBM na kailangan niya
17:14.9
Good Machiavelli,
17:16.0
the former professor.
17:17.7
Good Machiavelli.
17:18.4
Can he be a good Machiavelli?
17:26.8
Yung true sentiment,
17:38.6
Deportors of Vietnam,
17:50.8
alam mo yung sentimiento,
17:56.9
in their household.
18:04.5
discuss also where
18:05.6
the opposition should stand
18:08.6
ng debate ngayon.
18:09.5
May mga opposition
18:12.6
at the end of the day,
18:13.6
they're still skeptical
18:18.6
wolf in a sheep's clothing.
18:21.6
people's initiative thing
18:23.5
regime change strategy.
18:25.9
at the end of the day,
18:26.7
BBM might turn out
18:27.8
as the bigger threat
18:28.8
even though so far.
18:30.9
they never do tear the group.
18:33.5
At the end of the day,
18:34.2
BBM is a constitutionalist
