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00:00.0
Thank you very much.
00:30.0
Our guests for Hot Copy today.
00:32.6
First, we have Senator Sherwin Gatchalian
00:35.2
as we talk about various issues
00:37.8
from alleged ghost students and pogos.
00:42.3
And later on, we have Philippine National Railways Chairman
00:45.5
Michael Macapagal.
00:47.4
He'll be joining us for our second Hot Copy.
00:50.5
First, the headlines.
00:53.1
Today's big stories.
00:54.7
The Philippines, the U.S., Australia, and Japan
00:58.0
hold their first joint drills in the West Philippine Sea.
01:03.4
China responding with its own combat patrols
01:06.7
in the South China Sea.
01:09.2
And Israel reduces its presence in southern Gaza
01:13.2
with fresh talks for a ceasefire set to begin.
01:19.9
On Hot Copy this morning,
01:22.4
Philippine senators flagged the existence
01:24.8
of thousands of alleged ghost students.
01:28.0
in the government's voucher program
01:30.6
for senior high school students.
01:33.3
Victoria Tulad has the story.
01:38.3
Philippine Senator Sherwin Gatchalian
01:40.4
exposes alleged irregularities
01:42.8
in the expanded government assistance to students
01:45.2
and Teachers in Private Education Act, or IGASPE.
01:49.5
During a hearing of the Senate Committee on Basic Education,
01:52.3
the Commission on Audit, or COA,
01:54.2
defined ghost students.
01:56.0
Gatchalian says benefits,
01:58.0
given to some 19,000 so-called ghost students.
02:01.9
Ghost students refer to the following.
02:04.8
A significant number of absent ESC grantees
02:09.4
during a monitoring visit
02:11.3
whose absence cannot be satisfactorily explained
02:16.2
by the school officials.
02:18.3
Grantees listed as enrolled
02:20.9
but have not attended classes
02:23.5
since the start of the semester.
02:28.0
Students enlisted in a particular school
02:30.4
but attend a different campus or institution
02:32.6
are also considered as ghost students,
02:35.6
according to COA.
02:36.8
The Private Education Assistance Committee, or PAYAC,
02:39.7
confirmed Gatchalian's figure
02:41.3
but calls them as undocumented students.
02:44.6
PAYAC cites as an example
02:46.0
a school in Candaba, Pampanga,
02:48.2
which has 4,600 undocumented students
02:51.6
who are voucher program beneficiaries, or VPBs.
02:55.9
We specifically add for the,
02:57.9
ask for the class records of the VPBs.
03:01.0
Now, unfortunately, for a majority,
03:02.9
or for a big portion of their VPBs,
03:06.3
they're unable to present on any documents.
03:08.4
In other words, they're billing the government,
03:10.6
but they cannot present documents
03:13.3
to prove the existence of those students.
03:15.7
I cannot speak for the findings
03:19.4
of the previous audit team,
03:20.8
but as I have said before,
03:24.2
moving forward, we're going to look into that.
03:27.3
According to the...
03:27.7
According to Malonzo,
03:28.6
they received reports
03:29.6
that there are some people
03:30.8
who are trying to take advantage
03:32.5
of the voucher program.
03:34.9
I think for some schools
03:36.2
that have less than 10 or 1
03:41.1
I think this may be a mistake,
03:43.0
an honest mistake from the school.
03:45.7
But when the numbers reach hundreds,
03:50.3
this is really a significant issue.
03:53.6
Gatchalian also sees loopholes
03:55.6
that could open the scheme to abuse.
03:57.7
Very enterprising people
04:00.4
will put up a school
04:02.4
to get as many vouchers as possible
04:05.5
by attracting as many students as possible.
04:09.2
And in that process of attracting students,
04:12.5
the students might be legitimate
04:14.7
or might not be legitimate.
04:16.9
The Department of Education assured the Senate
04:19.5
they are investigating the issue.
04:22.2
Also discussed in the hearing
04:23.6
was another possible leakage
04:27.7
of non-poor students
04:29.0
to the list of beneficiaries.
04:31.8
according to Senator Sherwin Gatchalian,
04:34.0
the program has lost
04:38.0
Deped admits there is a problem
04:40.0
and says they are working
04:41.4
on improving their processes,
04:42.9
especially since they have yet
04:44.6
to determine the income bracket
04:46.1
of a poor family.
04:48.4
We will be able to come up
04:49.8
with the revised guidelines
04:52.2
and our timeline is in October.
04:54.0
We also will have
04:57.7
or concrete penalty
05:01.7
when it comes to those schools
05:04.0
who are committing any violations
05:08.7
with regard to the voucher.
05:11.0
The government has allotted
05:12.7
40.5 billion pesos
05:15.0
for e-gaspe's 2024 budget.
05:17.7
Victoria Tulad, ABS-CBN News.
05:23.4
And joining us on Hot Copy this morning,
05:26.0
we have Senate Committee Chairman,
05:27.6
Senator Sherwin Gatchalian.
05:31.6
Senator Gatchalian,
05:32.6
good morning to you.
05:33.6
Good morning, Karen.
05:34.6
Good morning to our televiewers.
05:36.6
Alright, before we start,
05:37.6
I want to greet you.
05:38.6
Abelated happy birthday as well,
05:40.6
since we are kicking off the week
05:42.6
knowing that you just spent your birthday.
05:46.6
Thank you very much for the greetings,
05:48.6
Karen. Thank you.
05:49.6
Alright, so not so good news.
05:51.6
19,000 ghost students
05:54.6
are undocumented beneficiaries.
05:56.6
Help us to understand it.
05:58.6
Does this mean the students
06:00.6
don't exist at all?
06:02.6
Or is this simply bad accounting
06:07.6
from the schools?
06:10.6
Actually, Karen, we don't know.
06:12.6
But the feedback from PEAC,
06:17.6
who is the filter or the gatekeeper
06:22.6
which is we have two programs,
06:24.6
the ESC for junior students,
06:25.6
the ESC for junior high school,
06:27.6
and the voucher program
06:28.6
for senior high school.
06:30.6
In both programs,
06:32.6
PEAC is the gatekeeper
06:33.6
or the filter of students.
06:35.6
And just to give you a background,
06:37.6
in the process of making it faster,
06:41.6
as soon as the private schools
06:44.6
government pays the private schools
06:46.6
so that their cash flow
06:47.6
will not be hampered.
06:49.6
And then government validates the list.
06:51.6
So in other words,
06:53.6
government pays the private schools.
06:55.6
First, before it validates the records.
06:57.6
But with the 2018 COA report,
07:01.6
it was discovered
07:02.6
that there are about
07:03.6
close to about 20,000 students
07:06.6
who are considered ghosts,
07:08.6
meaning there's no records whatsoever.
07:11.6
And what's starting is
07:12.6
there's one school in Candaba
07:14.6
and one school in Quezon City
07:17.6
which had 4,000 students
07:22.6
and 3,000 students
07:24.6
with no records respectively.
07:27.6
So if you have one or two students
07:29.6
who are missing records,
07:31.6
then that's probably administrative problems.
07:34.6
But if you have thousands,
07:36.6
there's something wrong
07:38.6
with the submission of records
07:42.6
that are being given to the government.
07:46.6
And the schools you mentioned
07:47.6
are private schools.
07:49.6
These are private schools.
07:51.6
That's why when we were conducting
07:54.6
even PEAC admitted
07:55.6
that if there's a few students
07:57.6
who are missing records,
07:58.6
then you can treat that
08:00.6
as administrative delays
08:02.6
or administrative problems.
08:03.6
But if you have thousands,
08:05.6
then there must be something wrong
08:08.6
with the submission.
08:10.6
as of this point,
08:11.6
they're still investigating that.
08:14.6
it's already a big red flag
08:16.6
that these things are happening
08:18.6
with the program.
08:20.6
Now take us through the process.
08:22.6
How much is the budget
08:24.6
of our government per student?
08:27.6
Depends on the location.
08:30.6
They divided the standards
08:34.6
NCR, Luzon, Visayas, and Mindanao.
08:36.6
So it varies from 7,000
08:39.6
all the way to 15,000.
08:42.6
A year or a month?
08:44.6
So if you add all of those
08:48.6
and multiply that by the 19,000 students,
08:51.6
approximately about 360 million
08:56.6
is now considered as doubtful accounts.
09:00.6
And the problem here is
09:02.6
since it's already paid
09:03.6
to the private school,
09:05.6
it's government now chasing after
09:07.6
those private schools
09:08.6
and asking for a refund,
09:10.6
which is quite difficult.
09:11.6
Once you pay something,
09:12.6
it's very difficult to get it back.
09:14.6
So that's another process flow
09:18.6
that we are looking at.
09:21.6
And even COA and DepEd admitted
09:24.6
it's a flaw that they have to look at.
09:28.6
Now, interesting is,
09:29.6
let's say there's a private school
09:31.6
because the intent of the voucher program
09:33.6
is a good one, right?
09:36.6
It's supposed to lighten the load
09:38.6
for parents who suddenly
09:39.6
either lost their jobs,
09:41.6
kulang na sa budget,
09:42.6
malaking tulong ito.
09:44.6
So when the school submits names,
09:47.6
let's say they submitted,
09:49.6
I don't know, Senator,
09:50.6
tama ba may be 500 names per school?
09:55.6
It really ranges.
09:57.6
Admittedly, there are big private schools.
10:00.6
There are small private schools.
10:01.6
And I saw the list.
10:02.6
It can range from, like you said,
10:04.6
500 all the way to 6,000, 7,000.
10:07.6
So it really depends on
10:08.6
the capacity of the private school.
10:11.6
So there is no mechanism
10:13.6
once the school submits the names
10:15.6
kasi yung gobyerno ibibigay agad ang pera.
10:19.6
So it won't affect cash flow.
10:21.6
Nobody from the DO,
10:29.6
I mean, not TESDA,
10:33.6
or the DepEd either or
10:35.6
walang pupunta doon
10:37.6
to check on the students
10:39.6
or they're in school.
10:41.6
Actually, that's a very good question
10:43.6
because the intention of the program,
10:45.6
there are two objectives of the program.
10:48.6
Number one is to decongest our public schools.
10:51.6
And like for example,
10:53.6
there are schools,
10:54.6
especially here in Metro Manila,
10:56.6
I would say almost 70 to 80 percent
10:59.6
of the senior high schools
11:00.6
go beyond the 40 is to 1 student to classroom ratio.
11:04.6
And the objective of this program
11:07.6
is to decongest those schools,
11:09.6
especially senior high schools.
11:11.6
Number two is to help the poor
11:16.6
go to private schools
11:18.6
in case that their school is decongested
11:21.6
or their school has inadequate facilities.
11:25.6
So those are the two objectives.
11:27.6
That's why the other objective
11:28.6
is to target the poor.
11:30.6
But the problem now is
11:33.6
when the private school submits the list,
11:37.6
government immediately pays the private school
11:41.6
because we don't want the private schools
11:44.6
to have problems.
11:45.6
To have problems with their cash flow.
11:47.6
And then the validation after.
11:49.6
So that's where the government determines
11:52.6
whether those students,
11:54.6
that list that they submitted,
11:55.6
are legitimate or it's problematic.
11:59.6
And there are two organizations that filter that.
12:01.6
Number one is PAYAK,
12:03.6
which is the private school association.
12:05.6
And then number two is DepEd.
12:08.6
And DepEd is the one paying.
12:10.6
But the one filtering,
12:11.6
the one that really validates each and everyone
12:15.6
So we need to also analyze
12:17.6
the relationship of these two institutions
12:20.6
whether they are in harmony
12:22.6
in terms of paying and validating the list.
12:26.6
I'm curious, Senator,
12:27.6
so nobody in the hearings,
12:29.6
it's not included in the process,
12:31.6
no representative goes to the school
12:33.6
and calls out the names of the students
12:36.6
just to check if they exist?
12:39.6
I think what they do is they do validation.
12:42.6
I'm not very sure how far.
12:44.6
How far is the validation,
12:46.6
whether it's random validation
12:47.6
or they really validate each one.
12:49.6
But in the case of that Candaba school,
12:52.6
apparently they went there
12:54.6
and then they couldn't find the records
12:57.6
of the 4,000 students.
13:00.6
But how many students are in the school, Senator?
13:04.6
About 5,000 apparently.
13:07.6
that's close to about 90% of the students
13:09.6
who have no records.
13:10.6
So I'm not very sure
13:13.6
whether the physical students are there or not.
13:16.6
But the most important are the records
13:18.6
because the records will be the basis for payment.
13:21.6
And it's not only one school.
13:23.6
Apparently, another school in Quezon City
13:26.6
and there are several schools that we saw
13:28.6
which runs into thousands also
13:30.6
which do not have the student records
13:33.6
that they are claiming they have.
13:35.6
Now, Senator, there's another issue here.
13:38.6
Is computerization an issue also?
13:42.6
Ideally, it would be easy to find records
13:47.6
if there's some kind of portal.
13:50.6
There's what we call the LIS,
13:52.6
the Learner Information System.
13:54.6
And all students in the Philippines have this.
13:56.6
This is basically given by DepEd
13:59.6
in order to track the students
14:01.6
if they move around different schools
14:03.6
or they move around the country.
14:05.6
So it's a unique number
14:08.6
that is assigned to every student in the Philippines.
14:11.6
However, it's kept with DepEd.
14:13.6
You're actually right.
14:14.6
It's kept with DepEd.
14:16.6
PAYAC doesn't have that.
14:18.6
So what they do is they validate it physically
14:22.6
and then they give it to DepEd
14:23.6
and then DepEd matches it with their LIS
14:26.6
which takes another step.
14:28.6
That's why we were doing the hearing, admittedly,
14:31.6
both PAYAC, DepEd, and myself.
14:34.6
Admittedly, there's redundancy in the process
14:37.6
but at the same time, there's also flaws in the process
14:40.6
because what happens is after paying,
14:42.6
that's where the validation happens with the LIS
14:45.6
and then at the same time,
14:46.6
there's also physical validation.
14:48.6
So because government,
14:50.6
my analysis of this issue, Karen,
14:52.6
because government pays in advance,
14:54.6
it's very tempting for enterprising schools
14:58.6
to submit the list and knowing well
15:01.6
that they will be paid ahead of time,
15:03.6
ahead of being validated.
15:04.6
So I'm not generalizing
15:06.6
but that's initially my assessment of this issue.
15:11.6
So I'm curious, like the Candaba School for example,
15:15.6
in the hearing, there were 4,000 students with no records
15:20.6
but the school is said to have a 5,000 population.
15:25.6
So did anybody check the school
15:27.6
on how many students are actually in the school?
15:31.6
Because it would be interesting
15:32.6
if there are only 1,000 students there or 2,000,
15:36.6
then that's a direct mismatch already.
15:40.6
Karen, this is also another issue that came out
15:44.6
and I looked at this through the internet
15:48.6
and through the materials.
15:50.6
Some of the schools are actually allowed
15:52.6
to do blended learning.
15:53.6
Like for example, because now it's quite hot
15:55.6
and they will say,
15:56.6
oh, we're doing blended learning because it's hot.
15:58.6
So you will not see the students physically in the schools
16:02.6
because they're also doing blended learning.
16:05.6
And the circulars allow private schools
16:09.6
to do blended learning at their own curriculum,
16:15.6
with their own curriculum.
16:16.6
So that's also another angle that we're looking at
16:20.6
because some of the schools that we saw
16:23.6
actually practices blended learning.
16:26.6
And that also might be another loophole
16:29.6
because they might claim that the students are at home studying
16:31.6
where in fact there's no students, so to speak.
16:34.6
What can be done, Senator, in terms of the process?
16:38.6
I mean, considering that, for example,
16:41.6
college in the Philippines in SUCs are already free.
16:45.6
We're technically moving towards an education
16:48.6
that's fully supported by government, right,
16:51.6
in the Philippines.
16:53.6
In effect, that's where we're moving.
16:55.6
But what process is lacking?
16:58.6
Because this is common all over the world
17:01.6
in terms of free education.
17:03.6
But what process is lacking for us to check
17:07.6
that the students are actually taking advantage
17:10.6
of the government program?
17:12.6
And it's not being...
17:14.6
There's no pilferage, so to speak.
17:18.6
Yeah, you're absolutely correct.
17:20.6
We're actually a trailblazer
17:22.6
when it comes to subsidizing education.
17:25.6
In fact, we're one of the few countries in the whole world
17:28.6
that gives tertiary education for free.
17:30.6
And on top of that, we also have scholarship program
17:33.6
for the poorest of the poor.
17:35.6
So you have free education,
17:36.6
and then you have subsidies for the poorest of the poor.
17:38.6
It's really a highly supported sector
17:42.6
when it comes to government subsidies.
17:45.6
But because of that money...
17:47.6
Let me give you an example.
17:50.6
For the subsidies for basic education,
17:54.6
it's almost as high as 40 billion pesos
17:56.6
that's being given to the system,
17:59.6
to the private sector and also to the education system.
18:02.6
For tertiary education, it's another 70 billion.
18:05.6
Close to about 100 plus billion
18:07.6
is being given to the education sector.
18:11.6
Because of that, there's a lot of enterprising people,
18:15.6
again, looking at the peso value
18:18.6
and looking at the loopholes
18:20.6
instead of the beauty of the system.
18:22.6
And that's where government needs to analyze.
18:24.6
Where are the loopholes?
18:25.6
And definitely there are, no?
18:27.6
And we have to plug that loopholes.
18:29.6
Or else, this very productive program
18:33.6
is now being abused
18:35.6
by enterprising individuals.
18:38.6
But are you able to tell?
18:41.6
You've mentioned three schools, for example.
18:43.6
Based on their investigation,
18:45.6
you had the COA supervising auditor at the hearing.
18:51.6
Are they able to tell at least
18:53.6
if the schools were abusing the system
18:57.6
or you just have students that were non-performing?
19:01.6
Because the other one, based on your hearing,
19:04.6
students that were not going to class,
19:06.6
students maybe that went to class
19:08.6
and stopped going to class,
19:10.6
the absence was not satisfactorily explained.
19:15.6
It's like you don't know if the school is being fooled
19:18.6
or the student who was given a voucher
19:21.6
was lazy, didn't get in,
19:25.6
So, there are a lot of moving factors in the issue.
19:30.6
There are claims.
19:31.6
During hearing, there are claims that,
19:33.6
for example, the private school submits the list.
19:36.6
And then a claim there is the student
19:39.6
either drop out or moves to another school
19:42.6
or completely disappeared from their enrollment list.
19:47.6
And that also, the number of students that are in that category
19:51.6
also runs into hundreds.
19:53.6
But the biggest red flag is those schools that I mentioned
19:56.6
were in thousands, 4,000 in one school in Candaba,
20:00.6
3,000 in one school in Quezon City
20:02.6
and a few thousand in other.
20:04.6
These are really big red flags.
20:07.6
Because how can they all disappear?
20:11.6
If you're talking about three, four students
20:14.6
who are not in the list,
20:15.6
maybe they dropped out.
20:19.6
But if you talk about thousands,
20:21.6
even the PAYAC representative admitted,
20:23.6
he said even thousands,
20:25.6
it's quite impossible to imagine.
20:30.6
So, we're looking into that.
20:32.6
And then DEPED is also looking into that.
20:35.6
But what the good offshoot of the hearing is
20:38.6
DEPED admitted that the process is,
20:42.6
there's loopholes in the process.
20:44.6
And admittedly, they also need to target congested schools
20:48.6
and poor students.
20:50.6
And the way forward here is to come up with a new circular,
20:56.6
a new department circular or department order
20:59.6
that will fix all of these things.
21:01.6
Target the poor, target the congested areas,
21:04.6
improve the process.
21:06.6
And hopefully, with this new circular,
21:08.6
we will eliminate the leakages that were mentioned.
21:12.6
Pero ang maghirap diyan is the extra layer
21:15.6
of target the poor in the voucher system.
21:18.6
Because I remember in UP,
21:20.6
of course, UP is now free.
21:22.6
Pero nung panahon ko at panahon mo, Senator,
21:25.6
UP was subsidized and a representative from UP
21:29.6
would actually visit the house.
21:31.6
To check if naka-electric fan ka ba,
21:34.6
naka-aircon ka, ilan ang kotse mo.
21:36.6
They would check if you were lying, right?
21:39.6
On the financial standing of your family.
21:42.6
But they can't do that, sir,
21:44.6
with grade school and high school.
21:47.6
I mean, do you agree?
21:56.6
So, I think we lost Senator Sherwin Gatchal yan.
22:02.6
We are going to take a quick break.
22:04.6
We're going to take a quick break.
22:06.6
KEDSTART will be right back.
22:08.6
KEDSTART will be right back.
22:30.6
Welcome back to KEDSTART.
22:32.6
Let's continue our discussion with Senator Sherwin Gatchal yan.
22:36.6
We're talking about what they've discovered in the Senate hearings.
22:40.2
Over 19,000 alleged GO students receiving support or subsidy from the government through the voucher program.
22:50.1
So I asked Senator, number one, is you wanted to ensure they were going to poor students.
22:56.2
But isn't that an extra layer of difficulty considering like in UP before, for you to be subsidized by UP?
23:04.9
Now it's absolutely free.
23:06.7
Pero nung panahon namin, somebody from UP will actually go to your house, check where you live,
23:13.5
check how many electric funds you have if you have a car.
23:16.4
They'll check the financial standing of your family.
23:19.6
But with these, we're talking about hundreds of thousands of students receiving this support.
23:26.6
Is that still possible?
23:28.3
You're correct, Karen. It's going to be an administrative challenge to check.
23:34.9
27 million students in our school system.
23:38.5
23 in our public school system.
23:41.7
About 4 million in our private school system.
23:44.7
It's close to impossible.
23:46.6
And that's where technology comes in.
23:49.0
And that's why it's really imperative to roll out the national ID.
23:54.4
Because with that national ID, you can actually create a database within DepEd
24:00.8
that will record the family income of that particular student.
24:04.9
It's going to be challenging, but because the philosophy of targeting poor students, Karen,
24:12.7
is because we have very finite resources.
24:15.6
For example, I'll give an example.
24:18.1
For classroom itself, we will need approximately 300 to 400 billion pesos
24:23.6
just to fulfill all the backlog.
24:26.3
So resources are finite.
24:27.9
So it's important that we make sure that resources are going into students who are in need,
24:34.5
of assistance, and who are deserving, meaning they are academically performing well.
24:41.0
So we just need to make sure that we are targeting the right constituent or the right student
24:46.4
who deserves the subsidies.
24:49.6
Okay. Now, the PAYAC data also revealed that there's at least 239 million pesos to be refunded.
25:01.3
So ang tanong ko, if...
25:04.5
Let's say the government has released the money to a private school,
25:08.8
the school is bound to spend the money.
25:11.6
I mean, assumed walang abuse.
25:14.6
But they're bound to spend it on programs or other things, right?
25:18.4
Kasi nandun na rin ang pondo.
25:20.9
Di pa napakahirap nito.
25:23.4
Because to expect a school to still refund, let's say, 10 million, 12 million,
25:30.1
as it is, a lot of them aren't even earning as much.
25:34.5
Absolutely correct.
25:35.3
That's the whole point of giving the money in advance, to help them with their cash flow.
25:39.0
So meaning, they have to spend it or they need to spend it in order for the schools to function
25:45.6
and to operate properly.
25:47.6
But because of that system, there are abuses that are happening.
25:54.1
And those abuses stem now from records not being submitted or records that are fraudulent.
26:00.9
And these are the things that we need to improve on.
26:04.5
How do we improve the validation process without hampering the cash flow and the operations of the school?
26:12.3
We have to balance that because not all schools naman are looking to defraud the government.
26:17.6
In fact, majority of the schools are very happy and willing to work with the government.
26:23.9
But we also need to balance that process because admittedly, some schools are trying to defraud government.
26:34.5
I'm curious, Senator, when does the government give the school the cash?
26:40.0
I mean, in terms of, is it June or is it two months before school opens?
26:45.6
What's the schedule?
26:47.0
As soon as the school submits the list of students, the government automatically pays the school.
26:55.3
So meaning, in the first two to three months of that time period when the school opens,
27:03.1
that's when the school gets...
27:04.5
gets their payment.
27:06.6
And then government validates the list one by one.
27:10.0
I'm not very sure at this point whether they validate it physically, meaning they go to the school and...
27:14.8
Yeah, it would be so...
27:16.9
Yeah, or they do random validation.
27:19.8
I mean, common sense, right?
27:21.1
You can just send one person one day by surprise and then just call out the students that particular day.
27:28.1
Yeah, I'm not very sure if that happens because we're talking about thousands of students.
27:33.3
But what I'm very sure...
27:34.5
I'm sure is they go there and they ask for records.
27:37.5
And then the records will also have accompanying prerequisites.
27:41.1
Some of those records will not...
27:42.8
Some of the records will not have the requisites.
27:45.6
Some of the records will be in jambos.
27:48.3
So in that case that I mentioned, they gave the list.
27:54.7
But when they went there, there's no records to validate or to...
28:00.1
There's no prerequisites that is attached to the list.
28:04.5
So it became a questionable list.
28:08.4
So what happens moving forward?
28:10.7
I mean, there are two things here.
28:12.9
Number one, if it is true that if the school, let's say, isn't abusing the system, technically speaking,
28:23.9
the request for funding should be increasing every year.
28:29.0
Because we'll have more students every year, right?
28:31.6
So it shouldn't be the same amount technically.
28:35.3
But at current, it is increasing over the years.
28:40.3
Like I said earlier, it's now at this...
28:43.4
For this school year, the subsidies being given to private schools amount to 40 billion pesos.
28:48.9
During the start of this program, it's less than 20 billion pesos.
28:52.1
So it has doubled over the last five years.
28:56.3
And the intention of that, it's a good program.
28:59.3
It's a good program because instead of building buildings for congested...
29:04.5
Public schools, you get culture, and then you put the students to private schools.
29:11.4
And that's where the...
29:13.8
In simple terms, that's the beauty of this program.
29:17.0
So you lessen on capex, but you increased on subsidies so that schools will be channeled to private schools.
29:24.4
But then again...
29:25.0
Which agency is mandated to check on the students?
29:30.4
There's a organization called PEA.
29:34.5
Which is composed of different private schools.
29:37.2
And they're supposed to be the filter of all of the students.
29:41.6
And that pays the private schools.
29:45.7
Is it right to say that...
29:47.8
I mean, are you satisfied with the system PEA has done?
29:53.2
The whole process includes PEA and DEPED needs to be changed and reformed.
29:59.6
Because admittedly, there are school students happening.
30:04.5
And there are non-poor students being paid.
30:08.2
In fact, the non-poor students that are getting subsidies,
30:12.5
when we calculated it, it's about 14 billion a year.
30:17.0
So in other words, we don't even know if the students are even in the middle class.
30:25.3
But because there's no income classification,
30:29.6
14 billion is being channeled to non-poor students.
30:34.5
For me, that's not the intention of the program.
30:38.6
The intention of the program is to target poor but deserving students.
30:42.6
And for me, that's a big leakage that we need to change.
30:46.7
Or else, resources are not being allocated efficiently.
30:51.6
So just one last question on this one.
30:54.4
What do you plan to do moving forward?
30:57.0
I mean, now that they've discovered that there are 19,000 students unaccounted for,
31:04.3
that have received subsidies from the voucher program.
31:08.6
There are two tracks that we are taking.
31:11.0
Number one is to change the process through a department order.
31:15.9
And DepEd admits that the department order needs to be reformed.
31:21.7
And they promise that that's an ongoing process right now.
31:26.1
And then number two, we will be holding the institutions to account.
31:32.0
Both the private schools.
31:34.3
Both PEA and DepEd also.
31:37.5
Because they're the ones that completes the entire process.
31:41.1
And we need to make sure that the 20,000, over 20,000 students that are flagged as GO students are validated.
31:50.3
I hope I'm wrong.
31:51.0
I hope those students exist.
31:52.3
I hope it's just purely administrative errors.
31:56.3
But we will look deeper into this and get more facts.
32:01.5
And if they are, for example, proven that this...
32:04.3
If these are GO students, then we have to hold people to account.
32:07.7
Because for the record, the budget for the voucher system for 2024 has been allotted, no?
32:17.6
It's released yun.
32:20.1
So kung baga, ang kailangan na lang is this particular school term.
32:24.5
What is the school schedule when it comes to high school and grade school?
32:31.6
Because I know there's a debate right now.
32:34.3
I don't have time to start it.
32:36.1
Right now, it's slowly moving to the original April, May, summer.
32:42.3
But we're still looking at July, August, a school opening.
32:46.7
So is there enough time to change, at least commonsensically lang, the system to check?
32:54.8
And that's why I commend DepEd for admitting that we need to reform the system.
33:01.5
And there's also loopholes in the system.
33:04.3
That's what's echoed during the hearing.
33:06.1
And we will continue the hearing until we get the department orders, the appropriate department orders in place, and also give us a report because they're now doing an audit on those 19,000, 20,000 Go students.
33:20.6
So we will also look into that and get a report on that.
33:24.1
Okay, my last question on education.
33:26.5
We'll talk about maybe other issues at another interview.
33:29.9
But right now, the heat has been intense, right?
33:34.4
At one point, parang we hit 42 degrees, was it, or 45 degrees Celsius.
33:39.6
So right now, schools are allowed, right, to actually cancel classes on their own, right, because of the heat.
33:47.6
But I'm not sure if this is good for us as a nation, right?
33:52.5
I mean, in terms of our learning standing worldwide, what can we do, Senator?
33:58.4
What is the long-term plan?
34:00.8
They say our classrooms aren't built for this kind of heat.
34:04.3
Pero nandiyan na yun.
34:05.5
We're also competing globally, of course.
34:09.5
This level of heat is unprecedented, Karen.
34:12.7
In fact, I don't remember when I was in school and also when I was during my stint in politics, for example, when I was a mayor, 40 was unheard of.
34:25.1
These past few years, the 40 degrees, even 45 in some areas, is really quite surprising.
34:33.1
And in fact, if you...
34:34.3
If you relate this to medical terms, fever is 38 and above.
34:39.5
People are now experiencing 45, which is high fever.
34:42.9
So definitely, we cannot force students to go into class when the heat is hovering at 45 degrees.
34:52.8
So two things, no?
34:54.7
One, LGUs are empowered to cancel class.
34:57.6
In fact, when I was in Bulacan last Friday, they canceled class in the entire province from kindergarten.
35:04.3
And all the way to college.
35:06.6
I mean, I'm talking about holistically lang.
35:09.1
In terms of learning, I know that they can.
35:11.5
But how does this affect us holistically as a country?
35:15.7
No, it's not good, definitely.
35:17.4
And there's so many studies already during the pandemic that the self-learning modules, even though it's the next best thing, but it's not the most effective.
35:29.8
And there's already a World Bank study on that.
35:32.5
There's already some studies by experts.
35:34.3
Where, okay, we don't have any choice but to take the self-learning modules.
35:38.4
But it's not the best thing, no?
35:40.0
And right now, when you say blended learning in the Philippines, almost 90% use that self-learning modules because they don't have access to the internet or some of it, the internet is spotty.
35:52.0
So the self-learning modules become the guiding document or the guiding textbook or the guiding material for them to learn.
35:59.8
But definitely, it's not going to be effective.
36:02.0
So the long-term solution here.
36:04.3
The long-term solution here is simple, to go back to our original summer break, which is April and May.
36:09.7
And we're running some figures and looking at where do we have more class cancellation, the new school calendar or the old school calendar?
36:20.8
It seems to me that this new school calendar, which is there's no summer break, is the one canceling more classes because the heat is just too unbearable.
36:34.3
Because just very quickly, when it was moved, it was to adjust to the international school schedule, right?
36:42.8
No, it was for the pandemic, Karen, remember?
36:44.9
Ah, yun lang yun, pandemic.
36:46.9
Because in 2020, we opened school on October. Remember, we were trying, because the whole world is getting unpredictable.
36:56.3
So walang issue, Senator, yung pag June, July, ang lakas ng ulan. Iba, Tati, ganun?
37:03.2
So lakas ng ulan.
37:04.3
Daming bagyo, puro cancellation. That's not the main issue anymore.
37:08.9
May issue rin doon, definitely. There's issue also on rain and flooding. That's why we're studying both the pros and cons in the old and new calendar.
37:21.0
But it seems to me that this new calendar, because of the heat and because it's getting hotter, there are more class cancellations compared to the old school calendar.
37:30.9
But definitely, we're still looking at those two.
37:34.3
I don't know, those two calendars.
37:38.4
So you support going back to the old schedule?
37:42.3
The old calendar, you do?
37:43.6
I support that. I support that. And not only because of the heat, but it also gives families time to bond because it's not raining.
37:51.7
There's flexibility for students to stay at home or to go out. And we're used to that already because for a long, long time, summer breaks happened during April and May.
38:04.3
All right. On that note, I want to thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you, sir, Senator Sherwin Gatchalian. Thank you.
38:12.0
Thank you, Karen.
38:12.5
All right. Now, moving on, the Philippine government urged to ease the burden on commuters following the five-year closure of the Metro Manila line of the Philippine National Railways, or PNR.
38:27.1
The closure was meant to speed up the construction of the 147-kilometer north-south commuter.
38:34.3
But PNR commuters say they are shelling out more for bus fares. Bus schedules also emerge as a problem.
38:47.2
Mas maganda pa rin yung meron yung PNR na train siya. Mahirapan kami sa oras. Nagahabol kami ng oras, sir. Nagmamadali kami.
38:56.5
Hindi namin alam oras dito eh. Nahabol lang namin ngayon.
38:59.2
Mas nagmahal po yung pamasahe ko.
39:01.7
Dati po, 16 pesos yung pamasahe.
39:04.3
Pamasahe ko mula tutuban hanggang bikutan. Ngayon po, 30 pesos lang po.
39:16.3
And now we're joined by Philippine National Railways Chairman, Michael Macapagal.
39:21.9
Michael, good morning to you.
39:24.4
Good morning po, ma'am Karen, and to all our audience, magandang magandang.
39:28.8
All right. So let's talk about, give me an overall situation right now.
39:34.3
Okay. Well, like what you said in the beginning of the show, the PNR's Metro Manila line was temporarily closed.
39:45.4
And temporary here is a five-year hiatus. We plan to continue or restart operation after the construction in 2028.
39:57.1
There are challenges. One of them is the…
40:01.3
Wait, how many commuters are affected?
40:04.3
By the closure of the line?
40:06.7
Well, it's between 25,000 to 30,000 daily.
40:11.4
And that is why we have deployed the buses, alternative buses that will fly along the affected routes of the PNR in the stations and in different areas where our passengers normally would go.
40:27.5
So there's good news and bad news.
40:30.8
Of course, we'd like to start with the obvious challenge.
40:34.3
Of course, we'd like to start with the obvious challenge.
40:35.1
Mas mahal ng konti ang pamasahe sa bus.
40:39.2
But konti lang naman.
40:41.0
However, the good news is that these buses that we deployed, they're able to go to the different areas where our commuters would normally go down to.
40:52.3
So like if they want to go to Divisoria Mall, for example, then they don't have to take two buses or tricycle to go to the palengke.
41:04.3
They just have to take the bus and the bus would stop directly in these areas, in these affected routes.
41:11.8
Oo. Pero more than that, kakit may bus, magbabago ang schedule din ng mismong pasahero kasi mas mabilis ang tren eh.
41:22.8
True. Magbabago po yung schedule.
41:25.0
Pero yung mga buses namin during rush hours, we are running every 15 minutes, no?
41:34.3
How many buses, sir, have been deployed?
41:40.2
Currently, we have 25 buses that are running in all of these areas.
41:46.7
In fact, ma'am Karen, I did buy...
41:48.3
Are they private buses that you've commissioned or they are new buses owned by the PNR for five years?
41:56.2
This is one company that was given an emergency franchise by the LTFRB to...
42:04.3
...accommodate our passengers.
42:07.1
The one company has deployed 25 buses.
42:12.0
I did my inspection last week for two days.
42:16.3
I went to several stations and I went to the routes that our passengers would normally go to.
42:25.7
Nakita ko, ma'am, the 25 buses is actually enough because in the morning during rush hours,
42:34.2
15 minutes, dumadaan yan, no?
42:36.6
And during the day, during off-peak hours, every 30 minutes, dumadaan yung mga buses.
42:42.1
So, our commuters, I think, and this is according to on-the-ground inspection that I did,
42:49.7
I think our passengers are served well with the bus augmentation program.
42:57.2
Now, other than that, we also have residents that will be affected.
43:03.2
They need to be relocated by the railway project and they need to be relocated, no?
43:08.0
So, how many residents are in Barangay 349 because their homes have to be demolished?
43:16.1
Take us through this.
43:17.7
I mean, masalimuot po ito.
43:21.8
Ilan ang pamilya sa Barangay 349?
43:26.3
Well, I do not know exactly kung ilan, no?
43:29.3
However, two things that are important, ano?
43:33.0
Right-of-way issues on the areas affected, no?
43:39.1
Ang ginawa po natin yan in Pampanga and in Bulacan.
43:43.4
In fact, the Pampanga to Bulacan route from Clark all the way to Metro Manila 9 and Valenzuela City, no?
43:51.9
Which is very near Bulacan.
43:54.5
That route is about close to 90% finished.
43:58.5
Which means, lahat po ng ROW, right-of-way issues,
44:03.0
so sa area na ito, was taken care of.
44:06.2
And ang utos ni President Marcos and also Secretary Jimmy Bautista
44:11.1
is to move the people to the same city or province where they were moved out of.
44:19.2
Let's say, for example, if you are from Bulacan,
44:22.3
inilipat ka sa Bulacan din.
44:24.3
If you are from Pampanga...
44:25.7
But let's talk about ito.
44:27.5
Yung Barangay 349, yung nakatira doon,
44:30.1
so you don't have the number right now.
44:33.0
I suppose this is in Metro Manila, right, ma'am?
44:37.9
Opo. Well, I'm assuming too, but it's not detailed here.
44:43.9
Pero i-assume na natin.
44:45.5
Kasi it's numbered Barangay 349, no?
44:49.4
So there are houses and establishments, not all homes, okay?
44:53.7
I mean, clearly, national interest takes precedence.
44:59.0
We need to do the railway project.
45:03.0
Una, do you have a schedule for the demolition?
45:06.3
Well, we have already started fencing activities
45:10.6
and truck removal activities.
45:13.4
The next would be construction.
45:15.3
And obviously, we cannot construct without doing the talking
45:21.4
and coordinating with the soon-to-be-displaced settlers.
45:31.0
That's why the president...
45:33.0
That's why the president has initiated the executive order.
45:35.7
And he put together a group of cabinet secretaries, no?
45:40.6
To resolve the issue.
45:42.2
And PNR, our agency, being the lead department,
45:48.7
that will talk, go down to the ground and talk directly to the affected people.
45:55.2
Ma'am, meron tayong budget for renovation.
45:57.0
Have you gone down to the ground?
46:01.6
So, just give me...
46:02.8
Give me an overview.
46:04.4
Per family, how much is the budget of the government to move them out?
46:08.6
Because at the end of the day, you will be demolishing their home.
46:12.2
So, that amounts for something.
46:14.0
Hindi lang yun ilalagay sila sa isang probinsya.
46:17.5
I'm sure there's a cash outlay of some sort.
46:20.8
So, magkano per family?
46:23.1
Yan po ngayon na pinag-uusapan at dinidecisionan.
46:26.3
Pero, pero ma'am, dahil matagal na itong project na ito
46:30.2
at matagal na itong pinag-uusapan,
46:32.0
meron na pong mga ginagawang mga alternative settling facilities para sa kanila.
46:39.7
We have coordinated with the DCEUD and also with the National Housing Authority
46:45.3
to build the settlement where we will move them to.
46:50.1
Not only in Metro Manila, but also in Laguna.
46:53.3
And you have to remember, we did this in Mapanga and Bulacan.
46:56.4
So, this is an ongoing process which started three years ago.
47:02.0
That is why I am very confident, ma'am, that this process will be taken care of
47:09.9
and that the target, as set forth by the President, will be met.
47:15.7
And this is in 2028, babalik ang TNR, which is stronger and better than before.
47:23.4
We'll be able to show the Philippines the most modern railway system,
47:30.0
which is at par with world's...
47:33.2
Whatever we're seeing in neighboring countries like Hong Kong, Japan, Singapore,
47:37.9
is the same railway system that we're doing and building here in the Philippines.
47:43.5
Frankly speaking, we need it.
47:45.7
We need it very much so.
47:47.8
There's no debate.
47:49.2
There's no debate.
47:52.6
In fact, we needed it yesterday.
47:55.7
When it comes to rail, the Philippines needed it yesterday.
48:01.5
We don't have time, but here's the last question.
48:04.1
May I ask you dito?
48:05.9
Karen, please ask Mr. Macapagal,
48:09.4
will the government have a subsidy for cheaper fares?
48:15.4
I'm not familiar with just how different the fare is from the PNR now to the bus, right?
48:23.4
So, tanong, is it possible to make it equal?
48:29.4
Parang no loss, no profit.
48:33.1
O, ganito, ma'am.
48:34.3
The train system, the PNR, is government-subsidized.
48:40.4
That is why, currently, we are the cheapest mode of transportation
48:44.3
compared even to the tricycle and to the jeepneys that fly the streets of Metro Manila.
48:51.2
Now, the buses that we have deployed, these are private buses.
48:56.4
That is why they are not subsidized by the government.
49:01.5
ang sabi ko naman,
49:03.4
please use the lowest available metric system.
49:08.8
mababa din naman eh,
49:10.1
ang difference lang is only 40 pesos.
49:14.3
40 pesos a day ang difference?
49:16.5
No, from end to end.
49:19.7
Kasi ang umpisa po yan, tutuban.
49:21.8
Matatapos po yan, in Alabang.
49:23.4
So, it's only 41 to 42 pesos ang difference sa pambasahe.
49:34.6
Now, these buses are comfortable, they're air-con,
49:37.4
and they go to the streets or to the areas where our trains cannot go to.
49:42.6
Which means, ma'am, in a way, parang na yung paas ng konti,
49:47.8
na ano rin eh, na over-camp din.
49:50.6
Dahil, nakakapunta yung mga buses in the areas kung saan malapit talaga,
49:55.6
bababa yung mga pasahero namin.
49:57.4
You have to remember, limited lang ang ano.
50:00.0
Station to station lang.
50:02.8
And also, ma'am, once this is finished,
50:05.5
we should be able to transport 800,000 passengers daily.
50:09.8
That's, you know, compared na to 30,000,
50:12.6
ang daming tao niyang matutulungan.
50:16.7
I think there's no need to sell the importance of
50:20.7
proving a railway.
50:22.7
I think that is a given.
50:24.7
Ang tanong ko, last question.
50:25.9
Will President Marcos Jr.,
50:29.2
before he leaves office,
50:31.5
will he be able to inaugurate the new train system?
50:35.5
Maaabutan ba niya ito?
50:38.6
Magandang tanong po yan.
50:40.7
Ito po masasabi ko, and I can say this very confidently, no?
50:44.6
The Clark to Valenzuela City line, ano?
50:50.2
Yan, may inaugurate po yan.
50:52.3
In fact, after the midterms, siguro in 2026, may inaugurate yan.
50:58.1
Manila to Laguna, in some areas, yes.
51:02.3
But the target is that we should be able to complete it.
51:06.1
So, what I'm saying is we will do our best
51:10.1
to finish this by 2028.
51:12.7
We should be fully operational.
51:15.0
Pero kung may ma-inaugurate siya,
51:17.4
definitely may ma-inaugurate siya.
51:19.3
This is, after all, a part of the President's flagship project.
51:24.8
And gusto natin na may pagmalaki ng ating mahal na Pangulo
51:29.2
na natapos ito during his office.
51:32.9
It would make such a difference to see something of this magnitude, frankly,
51:37.9
be finished in the next five years.
51:40.4
So, thank you so much for joining me.
51:42.1
I do hope you can come back on Head Start
51:44.4
because I think we can discuss more as the days go on, right?
51:48.4
This is a recurring issue in the next few days.
51:51.5
So, thank you so much, PNR Chairman Michael Macapagal.
51:56.6
Maraming salamat po, ma'am.
51:57.8
I would love to come back.
52:00.0
All right. Thank you.
52:01.5
And that's Get Start today.
52:02.9
I'm Karen Davila.
52:04.2
Thank you for watching.
52:05.4
You can play back this episode on the ANC YouTube channel.
52:09.5
Stay informed and stay with ANC.
52:25.5
It started with two carpenters in the backyard.
52:30.0
we still use the...
