PH envoy debunks China’s lies on West Philippine Sea

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Atty. Henry Bensurto Jr. is a career diplomat who explored the legal philosophy and laid down the ground work for the Philippines’ arbitral case and landmark victory against China. Now Manila’s envoy to Turkiye, Bensurto debunks Beijing’s persistent lies on the West Philippine Sea in this exclusive #FactsFirst interview.

Christian Esguerra

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Run time: 51:22
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00:00.1

Meron na ipinangako yung Pilipinas.

00:02.6

Itutaw natin yung ating BRP Shera Madre sa Yungin.

00:06.4

Nagkaroon po ba ng ganun?

00:07.6

China raw ay hindi nagbigay ng consent to be part of the arbitration

00:11.8

which the Philippines won in 2016.

00:14.4

Ano po ba yung totoo?

00:15.4

Ang magaling sagot dyan, false.

00:25.3

Magandang araw po sa inyong lahat.

00:26.9

Ako po si Christian Esgueran.

00:28.1

Welcome po dito sa very special episode po natin dito sa Facts First Convos.

00:33.1

Dahil makakausap po natin na yung isa po sa mga leading experts ng Pilipinas

00:37.6

parating po dito sa United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea.

00:42.0

So isa po siya rin sa mga instrumental people

00:46.0

dun sa paghahanda po ng ating kaso sa Permanent Court of Arbitration

00:50.6

na alam po natin na panalunan po natin in 2016.

00:53.7

So he is at present our ambassador to Turkey

00:58.0

I'd like to welcome to our Facts First Convos

01:00.7

si Ambassador Henry Benzurto Jr.

01:04.0

Magandang araw, sir.

01:04.9

Magandang umaga, Christian.

01:06.5

Magandang umaga rin sa mga tagapakinig mo at tagasin mo.

01:10.6

Finally, nagkausap tayo in the flesh na dahil gusto ko online.

01:14.5

Virtual, virtual.

01:15.6

Virtual.

01:16.3

Kumusta, sir? How are you doing now?

01:17.7

I'm okay naman.

01:19.4

I'm settled down in Turkey.

01:22.6

And I'm already rolled my sleeves.

01:28.0

And doing the work.

01:29.5

But of course, as you speak about Turkey,

01:32.0

you still think about your country in terms of what it's experiencing.

01:38.0

Yes, sir. Konting balik tanaw.

01:40.3

Can you talk about your role dun sa pagre-ready ng ating case against China

01:46.1

na alam po natin na panalunan natin noong 2016?

01:48.8

Yes. During that time, of course,

01:51.0

the administration of President Aquino and Secretary Albert Del Rosario,

01:56.1

I was...

01:58.0

I was asked by the Secretary to help him address or help him in addressing the issue of the South China Sea.

02:06.0

And so, of course, as a professional diplomat or a career diplomat,

02:11.8

obviously, it's my role and function and obligation to help the Secretary of Foreign Affairs

02:18.4

in terms of how to manage and how to approach the South China Sea.

02:23.6

And therefore, I did help the Secretary and the Department,

02:27.6

and the President in terms of managing the issues in the South China Sea.

02:33.1

Kasi noong mga panahon na yun, that was the time na medyo lumulutang na yung problema.

02:38.7

For many years, yung problema nandun.

02:41.9

Pero hindi natin masyadong binibigyan ng pansin

02:44.8

because we thought everything can be resolved peacefully and through negotiation.

02:51.3

This was before the standoff ng Scarborough?

02:53.1

Before the standoff.

02:55.5

Even before that administration.

02:57.6

When the administration of President Aquino came into power.

03:00.9

Ah, so pinag-aaralan nyo na?

03:01.9

So, can you say, in a sense,

03:03.9

ah, immediately after, during Mischief Reefs,

03:07.4

of course, nandyan pa rin yung mga issues,

03:09.4

ah, the government has been addressing that.

03:14.0

Managing it, trying to resolve it, pero nandun pa rin pala.

03:20.6

And so, it was a learning process for us also.

03:23.6

It gave us an idea exactly what China's strategy was and where exactly we were heading.

03:32.3

So, in a sense, it gave us a very good historical perspective.

03:37.3

An opportunity to take stock kung ano yung ginagawa natin, may ma-review natin,

03:44.3

and what should we tinker with and calibrate so that we're able to approach and manage

03:52.8

ah, this issue very well.

03:55.6

And in the process of that, obviously, we have to look at all options available to us.

04:02.6

And ah, in that context, therefore, one creative option is the third-party adjudication.

04:09.6

Arbitration na napanalo na natin.

04:11.6

And eventually, arbitration as the specific modality for third-party adjudication.

04:17.6

By the way, I'll make a disclaimer, no?

04:21.6

Ah, I...

04:22.8

I...

04:26.6

I am not the spokesman of the Department of Foreign Affairs or the government.

04:27.6

Ah, and therefore, although I belong to the Department of Foreign Affairs, the views I

04:32.6

will express here are my personal views and do not necessarily reflect ah, the views

04:39.5

of the institution to which I belong.

04:41.7

And...

04:42.7

Mabalinaw po yan.

04:43.7

Malinaw.

04:44.7

And I do not wish to make pretensions in terms of getting the job of, ah, officialOSS person.

04:47.7

Butter, ambassador.

04:48.7

In all humility, ay-ay-ay-ay-ay.

04:49.7

Oh, ah!

04:50.7

It's just that he's a executive Myself!

04:51.7

Oh, okay.

04:52.8

Sobrang baite ang buzzer

04:54.6

Pero yun nga po

04:55.4

At least malinaw po

04:56.5

Pero balikin natin

04:57.7

Bago natin

04:58.3

Kasi mamaya

04:58.9

I'd like to

04:59.7

Ask you about

05:00.7

The

05:01.2

Disinformation

05:02.4

Or influence operations

05:03.6

Being done by China

05:04.7

Para ma-correct yung mga

05:05.8

Mali

05:06.9

Pero pag-usapan muna natin

05:08.3

Yung kahalagahan

05:09.1

Kasi medyo mukhang maraming

05:10.1

May mga

05:10.7

Pilipino nakakalimot

05:12.0

Gano'n po baka importante

05:13.7

Yung

05:14.2

Permanent Court of Arbitration

05:16.1

Ruling ng 2016

05:17.2

Both as a legal victory

05:19.0

And of course

05:19.6

In terms of our

05:20.4

Asserting our rights

05:21.5

Dito sa West Philippine Sea

05:23.3

Na hindi lang purely legal eh

05:25.0

Kasi nga

05:25.3

Merong political aspect yan eh

05:26.9

So about the importance first

05:28.3

Yes

05:28.8

Yung

05:30.0

Arbitration is very important

05:32.0

I-reduce muna natin

05:33.4

In terms of

05:34.3

In the micro level

05:35.7

Among people

05:36.6

And

05:37.1

For those who are religious

05:38.6

Can always refer to the Bible

05:40.2

Which in a way also reflects

05:42.1

The psychology of human beings

05:44.2

As a social animal

05:45.5

We know na pagka may mga

05:47.3

Dispute tayo

05:49.1

Hindi pagkakain diyan

05:50.3

We try to resolve

05:51.4

That's normal

05:52.6

Instinct

05:53.6

And you will also

05:55.4

Note

05:56.3

Na pag hindi kayo nagkaintindihan

05:58.2

Then that's the time

05:59.5

You bring in a third party

06:01.2

Para

06:01.6

He can be objective

06:03.4

And then give his opinion

06:06.0

Essentially gano'n

06:07.2

And I think for those

06:08.7

Who are religious

06:09.7

And I do not wish to

06:11.3

06:12.0

Put any religiosity on this

06:14.8

Pero

06:15.4

Pero that's also reflective

06:17.1

Of the human nature

06:18.5

You do that

06:19.5

And then

06:21.1

The third party

06:22.2

Later on

06:22.9

As our community

06:24.1

It becomes a community

06:25.8

We create institutions

06:27.2

To make sure

06:28.3

That these disputes

06:29.4

Are

06:29.7

If not resolved

06:31.7

Between the

06:33.6

Disputing parties

06:35.5

Meron kang third party

06:37.2

Institution

06:38.2

That is

06:40.5

Lawful

06:41.2

Legal

06:41.9

Legitimate

06:42.8

And has jurisdiction

06:44.1

In the context of the

06:46.2

International also

06:47.6

Because the Philippines

06:48.6

Is one of the members of the Philippines

06:51.1

Is one of the members of the

06:52.1

Community of Nations

06:53.1

So we have a community

06:54.1

We don't leave

06:55.1

As an island

06:56.1

We are not separated

06:57.1

From the rest

06:58.1

Of other countries

06:59.1

But we live

07:00.1

In a community

07:01.1

So in that context

07:02.1

Of a community

07:03.1

It's very important

07:04.1

To have that concept

07:05.1

Of rule of law

07:06.1

Because that is the tie

07:07.1

That binds us all

07:08.1

In that community

07:09.1

The ability of states

07:10.1

Being equal

07:11.1

07:12.1

Follow certain

07:13.1

Behavior

07:14.1

Or norms

07:15.1

And to

07:16.1

Follow certain

07:17.1

Behavior

07:18.1

Or norms

07:19.1

And to

07:20.2

Follow certain norms

07:21.2

And part of that

07:22.2

Norm

07:23.2

07:24.2

If you don't

07:25.2

Agree

07:26.2

That's why

07:27.2

Negotiations

07:28.2

Then

07:29.2

A third

07:30.2

An option

07:31.2

Or an

07:32.2

Alternative

07:33.2

Is to go

07:34.2

Through

07:35.2

Third party

07:36.2

Adjudication

07:37.2

In the specific

07:38.2

Context of the

07:39.2

South China Sea

07:40.2

Then

07:41.2

Important

07:42.2

Because

07:43.2

The third party

07:44.2

Adjudication

07:45.2

Both parties

07:46.2

Agreed

07:47.2

This is one

07:48.2

Of the

07:49.2

Misinformation

07:50.2

That was

07:51.2

Agreed

07:52.2

To have

07:53.2

That third party

07:54.2

Adjudication

07:55.2

That's what

07:56.2

We call

07:57.2

Consent

07:58.2

One of the

07:59.2

Propaganda

08:00.2

Narratives

08:01.2

That they're

08:02.2

Pushing

08:03.2

Is that

08:04.2

China

08:05.2

Is not

08:06.2

Giving consent

08:07.2

To be part

08:08.2

Of the

08:09.2

Arbitration

08:10.2

Which the

08:11.2

Philippines won

08:12.2

In 2016

08:13.2

What is

08:14.2

The truth?

08:15.2

Of course

08:16.2

The easy

08:17.2

Answer

08:18.2

Is false

08:19.2

That's the question

08:20.2

And how

08:21.2

Under international

08:22.2

Law

08:23.2

How do you

08:24.2

Give consent?

08:25.2

There are

08:26.2

Basically

08:27.2

Two ways

08:28.2

The first

08:29.2

The traditional

08:30.2

Orthodox

08:31.2

And this is

08:32.2

Based on sovereign

08:33.2

Equality of

08:34.2

States

08:35.2

You can't

08:36.2

Bring

08:37.2

A country

08:38.2

To an

08:39.2

Adjudication

08:40.2

Without consent

08:41.2

That's why

08:42.2

It's important

08:43.2

But how do we

08:44.2

Give our consent?

08:45.2

The first

08:46.2

Is to

08:47.2

Talk

08:48.2

About third

08:49.2

Party

08:50.2

Adjudication

08:51.2

Then

08:52.2

The consent

08:53.2

Is put

08:54.2

In a

08:55.2

Document

08:56.2

Which is

08:57.2

Called

08:58.2

Compromise

08:59.2

09:00.2

In that

09:01.2

Compromise

09:02.2

You'll

09:03.2

Define

09:04.2

The issue

09:05.2

That's

09:06.2

One way

09:07.2

Of giving

09:08.2

Consent

09:09.2

But

09:10.2

There's

09:11.2

Another

09:12.2

Way

09:13.2

Of giving

09:14.2

Consent

09:15.2

And this

09:16.2

Is settled

09:17.2

When we

09:18.2

Have a

09:19.2

Dispute

09:20.2

This is what

09:21.2

We'll

09:22.2

09:23.2

So we'll

09:24.2

Layout

09:25.2

That

09:26.2

And then

09:27.2

The consent

09:28.2

Can be

09:29.2

Gave

09:30.2

At the

09:31.2

Start

09:32.2

When

09:33.2

It's

09:34.2

Signed

09:35.2

And then

09:36.2

Ratified

09:37.2

So it's

09:38.2

Two

09:39.2

Processes

09:40.2

Not just

09:41.2

Negotiating

09:42.2

And then

09:43.2

You signed

09:44.2

There's

09:45.2

Another

09:46.2

The United

09:47.2

Nations

09:48.2

Convention

09:49.2

And the

09:50.2

Law of

09:51.2

The Sea

09:52.2

We also

09:53.2

Ratified

09:54.2

We signed

09:55.2

With the

09:56.2

First

09:57.2

Signers

09:58.2

In 1982

09:59.2

By 1984

10:00.2

Our

10:01.2

Legislature

10:02.2

Ratified

10:03.2

So we

10:04.2

Consented

10:05.2

The same

10:06.2

Is true

10:07.2

With China

10:08.2

What's

10:09.2

The Implication

10:10.2

Of their

10:11.2

Ratification

10:12.2

It means

10:13.2

They're

10:14.2

Bound

10:15.2

To ratify

10:16.2

It was

10:17.2

A deliberate

10:18.2

Deliberate

10:19.2

Decision

10:20.2

And deliberate

10:21.2

Action

10:22.2

By the

10:23.2

Chinese

10:24.2

Government

10:25.2

To bound

10:26.2

Itself

10:27.2

By the

10:28.2

Provisions

10:29.2

Of the

10:30.2

Agreement

10:31.2

And therefore

10:32.2

All the

10:33.2

Provisional

10:34.2

Terms and

10:35.2

Conditions

10:36.2

Of the

10:37.2

Convention

10:38.2

They freely

10:39.2

And voluntarily

10:40.2

Consented

10:41.2

To be

10:42.2

Bound

10:43.2

I saw

10:44.2

A video

10:45.2

I think

10:46.2

It was

10:47.2

On TikTok

10:48.2

The claim

10:49.2

Was that

10:50.2

The Philippines

10:51.2

Or China

10:52.2

Op-out

10:53.2

On that

10:54.2

Specific

10:55.2

Provision

10:56.2

On that

10:57.2

Dispute

10:58.2

Mechanism

10:59.2

On that

11:00.2

Specific

11:01.2

Provision

11:02.2

Not

11:03.2

On the

11:04.2

Whole

11:05.2

Convention

11:06.2

What

11:07.2

They're

11:08.2

Saying

11:09.2

They op-out

11:10.2

Maritime

11:11.2

Delimitation

11:12.2

11:13.2

Maritime

11:14.2

Delimitation

11:15.2

11:15.3

Maritime

11:16.2

Divisions

11:17.2

11:18.2

All of

11:19.1

Those

11:19.8

O場ina

11:22.2

The

11:23.2

Clause

11:24.1

Are

11:25.2

Bound

11:26.2

I'm

11:27.3

Definitive

11:28.4

Ang

11:29.3

Boundary

11:30.1

11:31.2

Tajik

11:32.2

11:33.3

Was

11:34.3

Alerting

11:35.0

11:35.8

Out

11:36.2

Behind

11:37.0

That

11:37.9

Case

11:38.4

There

11:39.1

11:39.7

Got

11:40.8

11:41.9

There

11:43.2

Was

11:43.8

Driven

11:44.1

Yung maritime entitlements

11:46.0

Ay, hindi po yan

11:47.5

Pasok po yan

11:48.3

Maritime entitlement

11:49.8

Is a very important provision

11:52.1

Ng own clause

11:53.1

Ibig sabihin

11:54.2

Outside of those exceptions

11:56.3

Covered sila

11:57.6

Okay

11:57.9

Doon sa three na yun

11:59.5

Allowed naman po

12:00.3

Ng own clause

12:00.9

We have no problem with that

12:02.5

And they opted out

12:04.2

Fine

12:04.6

We're okay with that

12:05.6

But the consequence

12:07.5

Ang ibig sabihin nun

12:08.6

Outside of those

12:09.6

Three points

12:10.8

Or three issues

12:11.8

Where they're allowed to opt out

12:13.5

Bawal sila

12:15.3

So simplihan natin

12:16.0

Para dun sa mga baka nalilito

12:17.3

Very technical kasi no

12:18.9

Kasi ang ginawa ng China

12:20.2

When the Philippines

12:21.2

Nung nag-file po tayo

12:22.4

Ng arbitration case

12:23.4

Nung 2013 no

12:24.9

Tama po

12:25.6

Sabi ng China

12:26.9

We won't participate

12:28.0

And they didn't participate no

12:29.5

Tama po

12:30.1

Pero dahil yung consent

12:31.0

Binigay nila nila

12:31.7

The moment they signed

12:32.6

And ratified own clause

12:34.1

Pasok sila ron

12:35.3

Ibig sabihin

12:36.4

Dahil

12:37.2

Ni-ratify nila yung own clause

12:39.1

They voluntarily

12:40.7

They consented

12:42.9

To be bound

12:44.5

With all the legal consequences

12:47.4

Of the provisions

12:48.8

Of own clause

12:50.2

Isa po pong binabati dyan

12:51.8

For instance

12:52.7

Yung sinasabi ngayon ng China

12:54.9

Meron dahil pinangako

12:56.5

Yung Pilipinas

12:57.4

Na itotow natin yung ating

13:00.8

BRP Shera Madre sa Yungin

13:02.6

As far as you know

13:04.1

Matagal na po kayo sa DFA

13:05.4

Nagkaroon po ba ng ganoon

13:06.8

Tapos di ba lately lumalabas

13:08.4

Inamin ni

13:09.4

Attorney Harry Roque

13:10.8

Nagkaroon daw ng gentleman's agreement

13:12.6

Between the President din

13:13.8

Duterte

13:14.5

And China

13:15.6

Na status ko

13:16.8

Okay

13:17.3

Personally

13:18.7

I have no knowledge of that

13:21.4

When

13:24.4

The issue was first brought

13:26.9

To my attention

13:27.9

Ang pumapasa po sa atin yan

13:30.9

Wala namang official agreement

13:32.8

Yung sa pagtotoo

13:33.9

Sa pagtotoo

13:35.6

Wala namang din po

13:36.9

Kaming report

13:37.8

That we committed that

13:39.5

Normally yung mga ganyang commitment

13:41.8

They are

13:42.6

A very serious commitment

13:44.1

Yung tatanggalin

13:46.5

O nandyan yung

13:47.9

O nandyan yung barko

13:50.1

Dahil di ba narinig natin na

13:53.0

Nag-commit daw yung ating

13:55.1

Gobyano or somebody

13:56.8

Na at some point tatanggalin

13:59.0

Number one po

14:01.1

Normally

14:02.3

Napakabigat na commitment yan

14:04.5

And it has to be done within the proper

14:06.7

Context

14:08.1

Wala pong ganong context

14:09.9

Number two

14:11.5

Yung mga ganyang commitment na

14:12.6

Yung mga ganyang kabigat

14:13.7

Normally

14:14.4

Importante yan

14:15.8

Dapat nilalagay in writing

14:17.8

Pangatlo po

14:19.8

Kaya nga po

14:20.7

In international negotiations

14:22.6

Importante yung tinatawag nating

14:24.4

Full powers

14:25.6

When you negotiate

14:26.6

Hindi basta

14:27.9

Sino-sino lang ang pwedeng mag-commit ng

14:30.5

Bansa

14:31.3

In an agreement

14:33.4

Normally po

14:34.7

Yung mga

14:35.7

Merong

14:37.6

Kapangyarihan na i-commit yung bansa

14:40.1

They have full powers from the president

14:42.1

Para mag-negotiate

14:45.4

And to agree

14:46.5

Wala naman pong ganyan din

14:49.3

Dito sir, binabangin dyan ang context

14:51.2

When it comes to such a serious agreement as that

14:54.0

Ano ba yung konteksto na yan?

14:55.4

Kung sakali man gusto natin

14:57.1

Talagang

14:58.0

Pumayag man tayo na ito yun

15:01.0

Ano ba dapat yung proper channels or procedure?

15:04.2

Let me

15:04.6

Briefly describe to you

15:07.3

Yung how agreements are entered into

15:10.1

So bago yung mga tao

15:11.9

Mag-negotiate or to agree

15:13.3

Because apparently this is an agreement

15:15.3

And a very serious one

15:16.8

And therefore

15:17.7

Pinag-aaralan yan

15:19.7

Pinag-iisipan yan

15:21.0

And if that commitment

15:23.6

You want to have

15:24.6

You want it to be legally binding

15:27.9

May implication

15:28.9

May proseso po yun

15:30.4

Ang proseso po nun

15:31.8

Yung mga mag-negotiate

15:33.1

Meron silang full powers

15:34.6

From the president

15:35.8

To negotiate

15:36.6

To agree and to commit

15:38.3

With that full power

15:40.2

And second

15:41.9

When they sign

15:43.3

There is a ratification process

15:45.2

So meron din pong format

15:46.9

O forum na tinatawag natin

15:48.6

Formal negotiations

15:49.9

Lahat po yan absent

15:52.4

Lahat po yan

15:54.2

Wala

15:54.9

Walang full powers

15:56.2

Wala rin naman pong tao na

15:58.8

In a point para mag-commit nyan

16:01.9

Wala rin agreement

16:04.9

Everything is in the aspect of allegation

16:09.6

By the other part

16:11.7

At walang nagsasabi

16:13.8

Panahon ni Erap Estrada

16:15.9

Dinay na

16:16.7

Wala pa akong nadinay kay Gloria

16:19.3

Kay Duterte

16:20.6

Pero siguro po

16:22.4

The other question is

16:24.2

Can something as serious

16:25.9

As preserving the status quo

16:28.2

Sa Ayungin Shoal

16:29.9

Can that be made

16:31.7

Simply with a gentleman's agreement

16:33.6

Handshake lang between the president then

16:35.2

And Xi Jinping

16:36.3

At the end of the day

16:37.7

Depende sa arrangement

16:39.5

But if that arrangement

16:41.7

For example

16:42.7

Ay yung agreement na simsabi

16:44.7

Quote on quote

16:45.6

Redounds to surrendering your sovereignty

16:50.6

That can't be done

16:51.9

Because no person

16:53.8

From this country

16:56.3

Can lose a territory

16:59.9

O hindi po sila empowered

17:02.5

To do that

17:04.5

In fact it is a constitutional duty

17:07.7

By everyone

17:09.3

Especially the president, congress

17:11.2

To put their hands up

17:11.7

To protect the sovereignty

17:13.3

So yung agreement po

17:15.3

Is an indirect giving out

17:17.3

Hindi po pwede po yun

17:19.9

Basta-basta

17:20.6

There is a process

17:21.9

Tsaka pinag-uusapan po yan

17:23.6

Especially if it concerns a territory

17:26.4

You cannot give away a territory

17:28.8

Nobody's in power

17:30.0

There is a process for that

17:32.1

So yun sir, i-clarify kayo

17:33.2

Marami kayong words na binanggit

17:34.6

Territory, sovereignty

17:36.4

Tapos sovereign rights

17:37.7

Isa-isa yun po natin

17:38.8

Kasi based on what has been made public

17:41.7

So far

17:42.4

Diba, kinonfirm naman ni Harry Roque

17:44.5

Status ko yung pinag-uusapan

17:46.7

Pag sinayang bang status ko

17:48.4

Under a gentleman's agreement

17:50.2

Sa Ayungan Shoal

17:51.0

Ano yung status ko?

17:53.7

Madaming best natin narinig yung status ko

17:55.9

And so we have to understand it

17:58.1

In all its facets

17:59.6

In the first place

18:01.1

We have to ask a question

18:02.2

Ano ba yung status ko?

18:04.7

Are we referring to the status ko

18:06.6

Na every time pupunta dayan

18:08.2

Magpapaalam

18:09.3

Na pupunta tayo

18:11.7

Ang dadaling lang natin

18:13.0

Pagkain

18:14.4

Status ko ba yung

18:16.7

Okay lang na nandyan yung

18:18.3

Coast Guard ng China?

18:20.8

If this is the status ko

18:22.9

That we are referring to

18:24.0

I will tell you

18:25.3

It's wrong

18:26.1

Very wrong

18:28.1

That's not the status ko

18:30.6

That is consistent with our national interest

18:33.6

If we agree to that kind of status to

18:36.9

It is tantamount

18:38.9

To giving away your rights

18:41.7

Over your own property

18:42.8

Sa madaling salita po

18:44.0

Merong kang bakod

18:45.7

Sa iyo yun

18:46.8

Merong ka ng pinanghahawakan na titulo doon

18:51.6

Iyo yan

18:52.4

Pero yung kapitbahay mo

18:54.4

Mas malaka sa iyo

18:55.4

Pumunta doon

18:56.5

Ah hindi ka ba sa puwenta?

18:57.8

Hindi pupunta ako

18:58.5

Ayusin ko lang yung

18:59.7

Yung ano yung

19:00.6

Bahay ng aso ko

19:01.8

O sige okay

19:02.7

Bibigyan ko lang ng pagkain

19:04.3

Parang ganyan

19:05.7

Pwede ba yun?

19:06.7

Hindi naman pwede

19:07.6

Status ko ba sa akin

19:09.8

Na nandyan ka

19:10.7

Sa lupa ko?

19:11.7

Hindi rin tama yan

19:13.8

If that is the kind of status ko

19:16.3

That we are referring to

19:18.1

Actually

19:19.1

That's very dangerous

19:20.8

It is also

19:22.3

Amounts to giving up

19:24.5

You know why?

19:25.3

Alam naman akin

19:26.1

Especially sa probinsya

19:27.4

Pag pinabayaan mo yung tao dyan

19:29.2

After a period of time

19:30.7

Nasanin na siya dyan

19:31.8

Kanya na yan

19:32.4

And you will lose it

19:34.4

And so we have to be able

19:35.8

To think strategic

19:37.2

And long term

19:38.2

In terms of the implications

19:40.3

Of what we do now

19:41.7

You don't try to avoid

19:44.9

War now

19:46.4

Because it's been being used

19:48.6

In order to create one in the future

19:51.2

What you want is

19:52.5

You want peace now

19:53.6

Something that will be lasting

19:55.5

And durable

19:56.3

And what that means is

19:57.9

If you want it durable

19:58.9

That kind of peace

20:00.4

Must be respectful

20:01.5

Of our right

20:02.8

Of other countries' rights also

20:05.7

Only then

20:06.8

When we are able to respect

20:08.9

The rights of everyone

20:09.9

Including us

20:10.7

Will we be able to give importance

20:12.8

To the dignity

20:13.6

And that's when there is mutual respect

20:15.9

But whenever

20:17.0

That other party is in your land

20:20.2

Or in your sea

20:21.5

And they are creating

20:23.1

A quote-unquote status quo

20:25.5

Na we have to ask for their permission

20:27.6

We have to qualify the activity

20:30.1

That we can do

20:31.1

At bawal i-repair

20:32.0

That we have

20:33.9

We cannot repair

20:35.3

What is in our backyard

20:36.8

That it's okay for us

20:39.3

For them

20:40.3

To be there

20:41.2

In our own backyard

20:42.5

Malipula dyan

20:43.8

Because the moment

20:45.1

We agree to that kind of status quo

20:47.9

That agreement to that status quo

20:51.0

Actually amounts to giving up

20:53.7

What is ours

20:54.9

Assuming na nagkaroon nga po

20:56.7

Ng gentleman's agreement

20:57.9

Although dininay naman ito ni

21:00.1

Salvador Panelo

21:01.4

Assuming lang no

21:02.5

Sapat na ba yung sinabi

21:04.4

In an interview ni President Marcos po

21:06.5

Last year

21:07.0

Kung meron mang ganyan

21:08.3

I rescind it

21:09.4

At saka yung ganun po

21:10.3

Hindi po ba yan

21:11.2

Void from the very beginning

21:12.4

Kung yun ang konteksto na

21:13.8

Tama po kayo

21:14.9

If ever

21:16.4

If there is any act

21:18.7

By anyone po

21:20.1

That gives away

21:21.1

A property of yours

21:23.5

That's null and void

21:25.6

From the very beginning

21:26.6

Especially if it does not

21:28.8

Go through the constitutional processes

21:31.6

Nabanggit ko po yung process of negotiation

21:35.2

And how a country can commit

21:37.2

Because it's very possible

21:38.6

For one country

21:39.8

To agree on the limitation

21:42.5

Which means

21:43.3

You give away some

21:44.7

You get some

21:45.6

That's part of the negotiation

21:47.2

But not any

21:48.8

Pardon me for saying

21:50.0

Not any Tom, Dick and Harry

21:51.7

Can do that

21:52.5

And not any person can do that

21:55.1

There is a process

21:56.0

Even the President?

21:57.1

The President by himself

21:58.2

That's very dangerous also

21:59.8

That's why

22:00.9

Our kind of democracy

22:03.1

We have

22:04.0

We have the

22:06.1

We have the Congress

22:07.7

Essentially

22:09.1

And there is a process

22:09.7

And there is a process also

22:10.9

There has to be a

22:11.8

A referendum perhaps

22:13.7

Or a plebiscite perhaps

22:15.3

But it cannot be

22:17.0

A decision of one person

22:18.6

That's why

22:19.8

In the maritime delimitation

22:21.4

With Indonesia

22:22.5

And Indonesia

22:23.5

The maritime delimitation

22:25.5

That we have

22:26.3

That went through a process

22:28.0

What was that process?

22:29.2

We constituted

22:30.0

Negotiating panels

22:31.5

Both from Philippines and Indonesia

22:33.9

They negotiated

22:35.1

Where the boundary would be

22:36.8

And then after there was an agreement

22:38.9

They had to negotiate

22:39.7

To put powers to sign

22:40.9

And after that

22:42.8

It was signed

22:44.0

It was not yet in effect

22:45.3

It was just ratified

22:47.0

Very recently

22:48.4

And so

22:49.3

That aspect of agreeing

22:51.0

On a boundary

22:51.7

Remember

22:52.4

Whenever you agree

22:53.6

On a boundary

22:54.2

You lose something

22:55.5

Right?

22:56.6

And that losing something

22:57.9

Whether it's a sovereign rights

22:59.4

Or a piece of property

23:01.1

Or sovereignty

23:02.2

It went through that process

23:04.2

And so it was not just one person

23:06.6

The President

23:09.1

Knowing the process

23:10.5

Did not do it that way

23:12.5

Because we are a country

23:15.7

Of democracy

23:17.0

We are a democratic

23:18.0

Country

23:19.7

With processes

23:21.1

That is constitutional

23:22.7

And so that was the

23:24.5

Regular constitutional process

23:26.7

Of entering into a maritime delimitation

23:29.0

In a way you can say

23:30.0

We give up something

23:31.4

In order to gain something

23:32.9

And that process was not done

23:35.0

By one person

23:36.1

And not in one single stroke

23:38.7

Of a person

23:39.1

Or gentleman's agreement

23:40.9

It was part

23:42.1

Of a full

23:43.4

Pledge negotiation

23:45.7

By people

23:47.2

Fully and duly

23:49.2

Constituted and appointed

23:50.9

And the agreement

23:52.4

Being ratified

23:53.9

In accordance

23:54.8

With the constitutional process

23:56.9

And that's why

23:58.1

That maritime delimitation agreement

24:01.3

On exclusive economic zone

24:03.2

Between Indonesia

24:04.6

And the Philippines

24:05.9

Even if it was signed

24:07.6

It has no effect

24:09.1

On the constitution

24:09.1

Until it was ratified

24:11.7

By our own congress

24:13.3

With that ratification

24:15.0

By congress

24:18.4

Our commitment

24:20.2

To that line

24:21.7

Delimiting our exclusive economic zone

24:24.5

In a way giving up some

24:26.3

And getting some

24:28.5

In the process

24:29.7

That is constitutionally valid

24:32.9

That's how

24:34.1

That is the process

24:35.9

That is legitimate

24:37.0

That is constitutional

24:39.1

Whenever you talk

24:40.4

Of giving up

24:41.2

Certain portions

24:42.2

Of your territory

24:43.1

The protocol is clear

24:44.3

The system

24:45.5

The process

24:46.3

This is what I also want to ask

24:47.7

To your ambassador

24:48.6

What is the protocol

24:50.0

When it comes to

24:51.0

Let's say

24:51.6

It's not a big deal

24:52.2

It's not a big deal

24:54.0

On principle

24:55.5

The president of the Philippines

24:56.8

Is one-on-one

24:58.5

With the president

24:59.2

Of another country

25:00.4

And he's talking

25:01.6

About this serious thing

25:03.1

Closed door

25:04.2

Can they agree

25:05.6

One-on-one

25:06.3

Or who are the ones

25:07.4

Who should be

25:08.1

In the room

25:09.1

And after that

25:10.4

What should they do

25:11.5

So that it's clear

25:12.3

To everyone

25:13.3

What they're talking about

25:14.6

Okay

25:14.9

Every

25:15.7

Every president

25:17.7

Or every decision maker

25:19.6

Will have their own style

25:21.1

And so

25:23.3

That personal

25:24.7

Style will come

25:26.4

Into the picture

25:27.3

And it's up to

25:30.5

The wisdom

25:31.3

Of the individual

25:33.3

Person concerned

25:35.0

How to conduct it

25:36.7

That's the first point

25:38.3

Second point

25:39.0

As to what

25:39.9

You can commit

25:41.3

Or not commit

25:42.4

That is

25:44.8

Not exactly

25:46.1

Within the absolute

25:47.3

Discretion

25:48.1

Of any

25:51.0

Party

25:52.0

Or of the president

25:53.4

Even the president

25:54.2

The president

25:55.1

When he goes there

25:56.2

Will always have

25:57.4

The knowledge

25:58.1

Of what

25:59.2

He is empowered

26:00.6

Or authorized

26:01.8

To commit

26:02.8

And in that context

26:04.8

Will always have

26:05.9

The constitution

26:06.7

In mind

26:07.7

Because

26:09.0

We are a country

26:10.5

Of democracy

26:11.4

We are a country

26:13.3

Of separation

26:14.4

Of powers

26:15.3

And we also know

26:18.2

That our president

26:19.5

Is the chief architect

26:20.7

Of our foreign policy

26:23.1

And therefore

26:24.0

As a chief architect

26:25.7

He will have

26:27.4

The ability

26:28.9

Putting his own style

26:31.5

His own appreciation

26:32.9

How to do it

26:34.4

But it doesn't mean absolute

26:36.5

Because

26:37.4

Part of that process

26:39.0

The parameter

26:40.3

By which he can exercise

26:42.0

That discretion

26:43.2

Will always be limited

26:45.0

By the constitutional

26:46.6

Limitations

26:47.6

And processes

26:48.8

So then an ambassador

26:49.9

Close to a meeting

26:51.4

Between the president

26:52.4

Of the Philippines

26:53.6

And let's say China

26:54.5

Meron ba dapat

26:55.9

Nagtitake ng notes nun?

26:58.0

Are they bound to

26:59.0

To come up with a report

27:00.2

Right after that?

27:01.1

Para in black and white

27:01.8

Again

27:02.4

There's no

27:03.5

There's no

27:05.3

It's not a rigid process

27:08.1

Or a high-level process

27:09.0

Or a hard and fast rule

27:10.1

Na ganon

27:11.9

Because every

27:13.0

Individual president

27:14.3

Will have his own style

27:15.7

But as a matter of prudence

27:17.7

It's always good

27:20.5

To have somebody

27:21.3

Taking down notes

27:22.3

But you also

27:23.5

Should take into account

27:24.8

Sometimes

27:25.4

Tet-a-tet

27:26.4

So that the conversation

27:29.0

Is more

27:30.2

Friendly

27:33.1

Or everybody's comfortable

27:35.7

They can do it

27:36.8

Among themselves

27:37.7

There's no

27:38.5

Rigid rule

27:39.9

That prohibits that

27:41.0

Actually it will depend

27:43.4

On the president

27:45.1

Whether he would

27:46.4

Proceed on that basis

27:47.8

Or not

27:48.9

But always

27:51.2

He will be mindful

27:53.8

And he should be mindful

27:55.1

Of all the policy considerations

27:57.2

All the processes

27:58.7

As he decides

28:00.1

On what to commit

28:00.9

And what not to commit

28:02.2

And we also have to trust

28:03.8

The president

28:04.9

Whenever he does that

28:06.9

Because

28:07.6

As a president

28:09.4

He must have the full trust

28:11.6

And confidence

28:12.2

Of the entire nation

28:13.4

Now

28:14.2

That's one thing

28:15.8

But as to what

28:16.6

He will commit

28:17.4

Will later on

28:18.6

Be subjected

28:19.6

To the bar of

28:20.6

Those considerations

28:22.8

Whether it's right

28:24.2

Whether it's legal

28:25.1

Whether it's constitutional

28:26.7

Etc.

28:28.1

Kaya ako po

28:28.5

Yan natanong ambassador

28:29.3

Kasi nga

28:29.9

For instance

28:30.5

Paano kung nadulas

28:31.5

Yung presidente

28:32.1

In this case

28:33.2

Assuming tama yung sinasabi

28:34.4

Ni Harry Roque

28:35.0

Nadulas doon

28:36.5

Or nasabi niya talaga

28:37.5

Yung president

28:37.6

Gentleman's agreement

28:38.7

At ipinaliwanan nyo

28:40.5

Kung bakit mali yun

28:41.4

E kung lumabas nga

28:42.7

Sa bibig niya yun

28:44.1

E ano yung

28:45.3

Parang protection natin

28:46.8

Against someone like that

28:48.3

Na magkukomit

28:49.4

Which is

28:49.8

Not allowed in our constitution

28:51.6

Well assuming

28:53.1

And this is hypothetical

28:54.7

Assuming

28:55.6

Assuming

28:56.6

There is

28:57.5

An excess

28:58.4

And in law

28:59.9

I think

29:00.3

We call that

29:01.5

Ultraverence

29:02.5

Definitely

29:04.8

That

29:05.4

That will be

29:06.6

Ultraverence

29:07.5

And that will be

29:07.6

And because of the

29:08.5

Constitutional processes

29:09.8

There will be certain procedures

29:11.8

To correct that naman

29:12.9

And it should be corrected

29:15.6

But if it is beyond

29:17.3

The capacity

29:19.6

And the power

29:21.1

Of the person

29:22.6

It cannot be that

29:23.8

Pero the fact na ginagamit

29:26.0

Kasi siya ng China eh

29:27.6

Over and over again

29:29.1

Sinasabi niya

29:30.3

Nag-commit kayo

29:31.1

Miski hindi pa

29:31.9

We don't even know actually

29:33.4

Kung under President Duterte

29:35.0

Yung sinasabi nila

29:36.4

Nag-commit daw to

29:37.4

To tow

29:38.4

To tow away

29:39.4

BRP Shera Madre

29:40.4

Yung ganyan

29:41.4

Pwedeng gamitin for propaganda

29:42.8

Ng China

29:44.3

Sinabi mo na

29:45.4

Propaganda

29:46.0

But the thing is

29:47.1

They can

29:47.6

Allege whatever they wish to allege

29:49.8

We should assume that

29:51.3

They also know

29:52.1

The processes

29:52.9

The process of signing

29:54.8

The process of ratification

29:56.5

The process of the

29:58.2

Constitutional requirement

30:00.3

To ratify an action

30:02.8

Of somebody

30:04.0

Who negotiated for the Philippines

30:06.1

They should know

30:07.4

They should be aware

30:08.4

Because it's not that

30:09.4

We have this relation

30:10.4

To them

30:11.4

Yesterday

30:12.4

We have been engaged with them

30:13.4

For a long time

30:14.4

And they know

30:15.4

International law

30:16.4

So they are aware

30:17.4

Of these processes

30:18.4

And therefore

30:19.4

They cannot just allege

30:20.4

Something like that

30:21.4

And not provide the evidence

30:22.4

And if ever that was true

30:23.4

They also know

30:24.4

It will have no basis

30:25.4

Because it did not go through

30:26.4

The process of ratification

30:27.4

Assuming for example

30:28.4

And let

30:29.4

That the President makes

30:30.4

That commitment

30:31.4

That the President makes

30:32.4

That commitment

30:33.4

That the President makes

30:34.4

That commitment

30:35.4

That the President makes

30:36.4

That commitment

30:37.4

If he is really serious about that

30:39.4

He will submit it for

30:41.4

Ratification

30:42.4

Concurrents

30:43.4

By the Senate

30:44.4

To transform that commitment

30:46.4

Into an agreement

30:47.4

Locking that requirement

30:49.4

That commitment

30:50.4

Is just a personal

30:52.4

Something

30:54.4

But not

30:55.4

In the level

30:56.4

Of an agreement

30:57.4

That binds the two countries

30:59.4

So Ambassador

31:00.4

One of the

31:01.4

Disinformation coming out

31:02.4

From China

31:03.4

Of course

31:04.4

They are trying to

31:05.4

Get rid of

31:06.4

The Ayungin Shoal

31:07.4

Basically

31:08.4

More than 80%

31:09.4

Of the South China Sea

31:10.4

More than 90%

31:11.4

More than

31:12.4

90%

31:13.4

I have become even more kinder

31:14.4

I have become even more kinder

31:15.4

Please explain

31:16.4

What is included

31:17.4

In the PCA ruling

31:18.4

On why

31:19.4

The Ayungin Shoal

31:20.4

The idea of

31:21.4

Low tide elevation decision

31:22.4

Right

31:23.4

Please explain

31:24.4

In very

31:25.4

Simple terms

31:26.4

Okay

31:27.4

For us

31:28.4

To understand that

31:29.4

Maybe

31:30.4

It's good to

31:31.4

Give a little background

31:32.4

31:33.4

The maritime

31:34.4

Entitlements

31:35.4

31:36.4

Starting from the

31:37.4

Island

31:38.4

There are three kinds of

31:39.4

Islands

31:40.4

Because

31:41.4

Under UNCLOS

31:42.4

Well

31:43.4

First principle is

31:44.4

You cannot own the water

31:45.4

Without

31:46.4

The land

31:47.4

31:48.4

You cannot go to

31:49.4

The Pacific Ocean

31:50.4

Using your GPS

31:51.4

Coordinates

31:52.4

A to B

31:53.4

To C

31:54.4

To D to A

31:55.4

Is yours

31:56.4

It's not possible

31:58.4

The law does not allow that

32:00.4

For any country

32:02.4

To have

32:03.4

Maritime entitlement

32:04.4

It must be

32:05.4

Anchored on the land

32:06.4

This is the principle of

32:07.4

Land dominating the sea

32:09.4

One

32:10.4

Can only have

32:11.4

Entitlements over the sea

32:12.4

Provided

32:13.4

There is a land

32:14.4

Over which

32:15.4

It has entitlement

32:16.4

Or a right

32:17.4

So let's add

32:18.4

Entitlement

32:19.4

Right

32:20.4

32:21.4

For example

32:22.4

If this is the island

32:23.4

They have rights

32:24.4

To the water

32:25.4

But if the island is not

32:26.4

They can't have rights

32:27.4

To the water

32:28.4

This is also

32:29.4

What China is saying

32:30.4

In its nine-dash line

32:32.4

They have historic

32:33.4

Rights

32:34.4

Or over that

32:35.4

Historic waters

32:36.4

That's not true

32:37.4

That

32:38.4

Tribunal

32:39.4

Has

32:40.4

Prohibited

32:41.4

32:42.4

But before

32:43.4

Going to that

32:44.4

Going back to the principle

32:45.4

Land dominates

32:46.4

The sea

32:47.4

You cannot have

32:48.4

Entitlement

32:49.4

Without

32:50.4

The land

32:51.4

But there are three kinds

32:52.4

Of land

32:53.4

Called

32:54.4

Or island

32:55.4

The first classification

32:56.4

The

32:57.4

Under

32:58.4

Article 121

32:59.4

Of UNDOS

33:00.4

What we call

33:01.4

Naturally formed

33:02.4

Islands

33:03.4

So yung

33:04.4

Naturally formed

33:05.4

Islands

33:06.4

Will generate

33:07.4

The maximum

33:08.4

Entitlement

33:09.4

All the way to

33:10.4

Exclusive economic zone

33:11.4

Which is 200

33:12.4

Pero meron ding

33:13.4

Isang klase

33:14.4

Nang

33:15.4

Isla

33:16.4

Quote unquote

33:17.4

Pero hindi naman talaga siya

33:18.4

Isla na

33:19.4

Naturally formed

33:20.4

Island

33:21.4

Capable of sustaining

33:22.4

Human

33:23.4

Human habitation

33:24.4

Ito yung tawag nating

33:25.4

Bato

33:26.4

Or rock

33:27.4

Ang pinakaiba nya

33:28.4

Doon sa

33:29.4

Naturally formed

33:30.4

Island

33:31.4

Yung unang category

33:32.4

Of sustaining

33:33.4

Human habitation

33:34.4

On its own

33:35.4

Tsaka economic life

33:36.4

On its own

33:37.4

Then it will generate

33:38.4

The full entitlement

33:39.4

Up to 200

33:40.4

Pero if it is

33:41.4

Just a rock

33:42.4

A rock means

33:43.4

Hindi siya capable

33:44.4

Of sustaining

33:45.4

Human habitation

33:46.4

And

33:47.4

Economic life

33:48.4

On its own

33:49.4

Hindi artificial

33:50.4

Ang magi-generate

33:51.4

Niya lang

33:52.4

12 nautical miles

33:53.4

Pero may

33:54.4

Ikatlong klase

33:55.4

Ito yung tinatawag nating

33:56.4

Low tide elevation

33:57.4

Ito yung

33:58.4

Pag pumunta sa

33:59.4

Kamigin

34:00.4

Merong sun shoal

34:01.4

Ano

34:02.4

Pagka

34:03.4

Pagka

34:04.4

Low tide nakikita mo

34:05.4

And then you can go there

34:06.4

Pero nawawala siya

34:07.4

Pag high tide

34:08.4

Pag nawala siya ng

34:09.4

High tide

34:10.4

Yang

34:11.4

Yang sand na yan

34:12.4

Eh ang tawag dyan

34:13.4

Low tide elevation

34:14.4

Under international law

34:16.4

Yang low tide elevation na yan

34:18.4

Is not an island

34:19.4

That will generate

34:20.4

Maritime entitlement

34:22.4

It is

34:23.4

But

34:24.4

A continental shelf

34:26.4

As a continental shelf

34:28.4

Kaninong continental shelf

34:30.4

Siya

34:31.4

Is a question of proximity

34:33.4

So kung nandun siya

34:34.4

Within 200

34:35.4

Nang isang coastal state

34:37.4

Continental shelf siya

34:40.4

Exclusive

34:41.4

Nung state na yan

34:42.4

Which in this case

34:43.4

The Philippines

34:44.4

The Philippines

34:45.4

And by the way

34:46.4

It's not a territory

34:47.4

34:48.4

Since it's not a territory

34:49.4

There cannot be a territorial dispute

34:52.4

Over that

34:53.4

Tagalogin natin sir

34:54.4

Yung continental shelf

34:55.4

Okay

34:56.4

Yung continental shelf po

34:58.4

Mapapansin ninyo

34:59.4

Pag nagpupunta kayo

35:00.4

Sa Boracay

35:01.4

Meron pong lupa

35:02.4

Wala naman po kasing

35:03.4

Isla na lumulutang

35:04.4

On its own

35:05.4

Meron po siyang continuity

35:06.4

Ng lupa

35:07.4

Yung lupa na yun

35:08.4

Na submerged

35:09.4

Below the water

35:10.4

Yan po yung tinatawag natin

35:11.4

Continental shelf

35:12.4

35:13.4

Yung continental shelf

35:14.4

Na po yan

35:15.4

From the low water mark

35:16.4

Diba

35:17.4

Ang low water mark

35:18.4

Yan po yung baseline

35:19.4

If it's a normal baseline

35:20.4

Yung low water mark po

35:21.4

Kapag punta kayo sa Boracay

35:22.4

Meron po yung

35:23.4

Continental shelf

35:24.4

35:25.4

Yung continental shelf

35:26.4

Na po yan

35:27.4

From the low water mark

35:28.4

Diba

35:29.4

Kapag punta kayo sa Boracay

35:30.4

May dalawa kayong nakikitang linya

35:31.4

Yung linya na nakikreate ng high tide

35:32.4

Tapos yung linya na nakikreate ng low tide

35:33.4

Yung po yung low water mark

35:34.4

Yung low tide na

35:35.4

Diyan po

35:36.4

Pababa

35:37.4

Yan ang continental shelf mo

35:38.4

Magbilang ka ng 200

35:39.4

Sa iyo yan

35:40.4

At yung ayung insyol

35:41.4

Pasok doon

35:42.4

Sa 200

35:43.4

Pasok po sa 200

35:44.4

Sa ating yan

35:45.4

So ang sinabi po

35:46.4

Ng arbitration

35:47.4

And this

35:48.4

The law

35:49.4

35:50.4

The

35:51.4

Arbitral

35:52.4

Tribunal

35:53.4

Simplified

35:54.4

Ang

35:55.4

Arbitration

35:56.4

Ang

35:57.4

Arbitration

35:58.4

So tribunal simply confirm

35:59.4

What

36:00.4

What international principles

36:02.4

Say

36:03.4

36:04.4

And they confirm na

36:05.4

Yung

36:06.4

Number one

36:07.4

Question of fact

36:08.4

Ano ba yung ayung insyol

36:09.4

36:10.4

On the question of fact

36:11.4

Isla ba to

36:12.4

Bato ba to

36:13.4

O low tide elevation

36:15.4

So ang sabi ng

36:16.4

Ang sabi ng

36:17.4

Ng tribunal

36:18.4

36:19.4

Factually

36:20.4

Objectively

36:21.4

Based on science

36:22.4

Hindi po hulaan na

36:23.4

Hindi arbitrary

36:25.4

But based on science

36:26.4

Ito pong

36:27.4

Ang

36:28.4

Ayung insyol

36:29.4

Is low tide elevation

36:30.4

Ang ibig pong sabihin nun

36:31.4

Pag high tide

36:32.4

Nawawala siya

36:33.4

At hindi po

36:34.4

Ang basehan nila

36:35.4

Hindi dahil sinabi ni Juan

36:36.4

Ni Pedro

36:37.4

O sinuman

36:38.4

But dahil

36:39.4

Sa pag-aaral

36:40.4

Pag apply ng science

36:41.4

Satellite

36:42.4

Etc

36:43.4

36:44.4

Confirm nila

36:45.4

Na talagang

36:46.4

Nawawala ito

36:47.4

During high tide

36:48.4

Ergo

36:49.4

Ang conclusion

36:50.4

Factually

36:51.4

Objectively

36:52.4

Ito pong

36:53.4

Ayung insyol

36:54.4

Low tide elevation

36:55.4

36:56.4

Once you have answered the question

36:57.4

Law tide elevation siya

36:58.4

Ano nga yun ang implication niya

36:59.4

So ang implication niya

37:00.4

Under international law

37:01.4

As a low tide elevation

37:02.4

Number one

37:03.4

Hindi siya pwedeng mag-generate ng

37:04.4

Maritime entitlement

37:05.4

Number two

37:06.4

Continental shelf siya

37:07.4

Number three

37:08.4

As to the question of

37:09.4

Kaninong continental shelf

37:10.4

Minesure niya

37:11.4

Kung ano yung malapit na

37:12.4

Coastal state

37:13.4

Minesure niya yung

37:14.4

200

37:15.4

Lumabas sa kanyang

37:16.4

Continental shelf

37:17.4

Number three

37:18.4

As to the question of

37:19.4

Kaninong continental shelf

37:20.4

Minesure niya

37:21.4

Kung ano yung malapit na

37:22.4

Coastal state

37:23.4

Minesure niya yung

37:24.4

200

37:25.4

Lumabas sa kanyang

37:26.4

Pag-aaral

37:28.4

Na yung wala

37:29.4

Wala tayong kalaban

37:30.4

Walang overlap doon

37:32.4

Claro

37:33.4

Na continental shelf siya

37:34.4

Dahil nasa 200

37:35.4

Okay

37:36.4

Ng Pilipinas

37:37.4

Napakalinaw

37:38.4

Tsaka pag tininan po natin yung mga para

37:39.4

Napakalayo ng China

37:40.4

Doon sa Ayung insyol

37:41.4

Sila yung garapal na

37:42.4

Tama po

37:43.4

Nag-i-encroach

37:44.4

Tsaka hindi lang yun

37:45.4

Kahit na pagpalagin natin

37:46.4

Yung mga ibang bato doon

37:47.4

37:48.4

Disputed

37:50.4

Pagpalagin natin

37:51.4

May ibang manken

37:52.4

O may ibang nakatira

37:53.4

Wala pong

37:54.4

Maka

37:55.4

Maritime entitlement

37:56.4

Yung mga bato niyan

37:57.4

Na lalagpas

37:58.4

O magko-cover

37:59.4

Sa Ayung insyol

38:00.4

Napakalinaw

38:01.4

So in effect

38:02.4

Talagang

38:04.4

Undisputedly

38:05.4

Ours

38:06.4

Okay

38:07.4

Pero yun nga

38:08.4

Undisputedly

38:09.4

Malinaw po sa batas no?

38:11.4

So maling sabihan

38:12.4

Let's say even in reports

38:13.4

Na yung Ayung insyol

38:14.4

Is a

38:15.4

Is disputed

38:16.4

Exactly

38:17.4

And therefore

38:18.4

So matutal

38:20.4

Kung sino man yung nagsasabi na

38:21.4

Disputed dyan

38:23.4

Mali po

38:24.4

Paano ba nagiging

38:25.4

Disputed dyan

38:26.4

Unang unang

38:27.4

Territoryo ba yan?

38:28.4

Eh hindi nga eh

38:29.4

Ang sabi

38:30.4

Continental shelf

38:31.4

So kung hindi siya

38:32.4

Territoryo

38:33.4

Hindi siya pwedeng

38:34.4

38:35.4

Subject of

38:36.4

Territorial dispute

38:37.4

Kasi wala yung

38:38.4

Territoryo doon

38:39.4

38:40.4

38:41.4

Pangalawa po

38:42.4

Wala rin namang

38:43.4

Overlap

38:44.4

So hindi siya pwedeng

38:45.4

Maging disputed

38:46.4

38:47.4

Factually na po ito

38:48.4

Ha na

38:49.4

And because it's not a

38:50.4

Territory

38:51.4

Rather it is a

38:52.4

Continental shelf

38:53.4

Therefore

38:54.4

Cannot be

38:55.4

Claimed

38:56.4

Or owned

38:57.4

By anyone

38:58.4

As a territory

38:59.4

And cannot

39:00.4

Therefore be a subject

39:01.4

Of any

39:02.4

Dispute

39:03.4

Dyan madali lang

39:04.4

Sagutin talagyan

39:06.4

May overlap ha

39:07.4

Wala

39:08.4

Nasa 200 ba

39:09.4

Nang isang

39:10.4

Coastal state

39:11.4

39:12.4

Sinong coastal state?

39:13.4

Pilipinas

39:14.4

Ergo

39:15.4

Ang sagot po

39:16.4

Continental shelf siya

39:17.4

Ng Pilipinas

39:18.4

At sa batas po

39:20.4

Ang sinasabi

39:21.4

Yung continental shelf

39:22.4

Ng isang coastal state

39:23.4

In this case

39:24.4

The Philippines

39:25.4

We have the exclusive

39:26.4

Jurisdiction

39:27.4

39:28.4

Explore

39:29.4

Exploit

39:30.4

Exclusively po ha

39:31.4

Sa salitang Tagalog po

39:32.4

Tayo lang

39:33.4

Excluded ang ibang

39:34.4

Bansa

39:35.4

39:36.4

The natural

39:37.4

Resources

39:38.4

In the area

39:39.4

Living

39:40.4

39:41.4

Non-living

39:42.4

Organic

39:43.4

39:44.4

Non-organic

39:45.4

Okay

39:46.4

39:47.4

Masi-flash out pa po natin

39:48.4

Yung binanggit na no?

39:49.4

Sige po

39:50.4

In concrete terms

39:51.4

Ano yung mga pwedeng

39:52.4

Gawin sa Iungin

39:53.4

Number one

39:54.4

Tama

39:55.4

Okay lang

39:56.4

Naran din yung barko natin

39:57.4

Okay?

39:58.4

Tama po yan

39:59.4

Pwede ba natin

40:00.4

I-develop

40:01.4

Let's say

40:02.4

Yung low tide elevation na yan?

40:03.4

Tama po

40:04.4

At ang

40:05.4

Pagpapasya

40:06.4

Kung anong

40:07.4

Gagawin sa Iungin Shoal

40:08.4

Isa lang pong bansa

40:09.4

Ang pwedeng magpasya niyan

40:10.4

Tayo lang po

40:11.4

Kung kaninong continental shelf siya

40:13.4

Yung bansa na yun

40:14.4

Ang may

40:15.4

Exclusibong

40:16.4

Karapatan

40:17.4

Na gawin

40:18.4

Kung ano

40:19.4

Ang pwedeng gawin

40:20.4

Doon sa shoal na yun

40:21.4

40:22.4

Kung gusto niyang

40:23.4

Maglagay

40:24.4

Nang

40:25.4

Nipahat

40:26.4

Pwede

40:27.4

Kung gusto natin gawin

40:28.4

Military garrison

40:30.4

Pwede

40:31.4

Kung gusto natin gawin

40:32.4

Artificial land

40:34.4

Pwede

40:35.4

Ang sagot po

40:36.4

Kung tayo may ganong karapatan

40:37.4

Ang China ba

40:38.4

May ganong karapatan

40:39.4

Ang sagot po

40:40.4

Wala

40:41.4

Wala

40:42.4

Kasi po

40:43.4

Number one

40:44.4

Hindi naman po nila

40:45.4

Continental shelf yun

40:46.4

Pangalawa po

40:47.4

Hindi naman po

40:48.4

Territoryan

40:49.4

Hindi nila pwedeng sabihin

40:50.4

Hindi nila pwedeng sabihin

40:51.4

Disputed namin yan

40:53.4

So wala po talagang basihan

40:55.4

By which yung ayung in shoal na yun

40:57.4

E kanilang ang kinin

40:59.4

Pangalawa po

41:00.4

Ang implication din nung ganun

41:02.4

Hindi po pwedeng

41:04.4

Harangan yung ating mga

41:07.4

Mga barko

41:08.4

Na magpunta doon

41:10.4

41:11.4

Hindi rin po pwedeng

41:12.4

Umistambay sila doon

41:13.4

Meron silang freedom of navigation

41:15.4

Kadaan

41:16.4

41:17.4

But freedom of navigation

41:18.4

Is different from

41:19.4

Sovereignty patrol

41:20.4

When they conduct

41:22.4

And do sovereignty patrol

41:24.4

Hindi na po yung consistent

41:26.4

Sa own clause

41:27.4

In terms of freedom of navigation

41:29.4

Dahil yun po

41:30.4

Is an act of sovereignty already

41:33.4

By another country

41:34.4

Indicating that they are claiming that

41:37.4

Which is wrong

41:38.4

Because they have no right

41:40.4

Pangalawa po

41:41.4

Nung una

41:42.4

Eh ito eh hindi lang pagkakasunduan

41:44.4

Eh meron na pong tribunal

41:47.4

Constituted within

41:49.4

The context of international law

41:51.4

That legitimately

41:53.4

Confirmed

41:54.4

Na wala silang karapatan

41:56.4

So all things considered po

41:57.4

Talagang walang basihan mo

41:59.4

Okay

42:00.4

So napakalinaw

42:01.4

Yung panalo natin dyan

42:03.4

Pero ano yung mga options po

42:04.4

Na pwede natin gawin

42:05.4

Kasi ang reality is that

42:06.4

We're being prevented by China

42:08.4

From doing our own thing

42:10.4

Gaya sa sarili nating bakuran

42:11.4

42:12.4

By law muna

42:13.4

Ano ba

42:14.4

Meron pa ba tayo pwedeng dulugan

42:15.4

For instance

42:16.4

Unang una

42:17.4

Unang una ang importante

42:18.4

We're all settled

42:19.4

Na tayong may karapatan dyan

42:21.4

Pangalawa

42:22.4

Kung tayo may karapatan dyan

42:24.4

Hindi naman po pwedeng

42:26.4

Hindi natin

42:27.4

I-assert yung ating karapatan dyan

42:30.4

Kasi parang katulad ng natin

42:32.4

Pag meron tayong lupain sa probinsya

42:34.4

At hindi natin binibisita

42:36.4

At hindi tayo

42:38.4

Gumagawa ng acts of ownership

42:40.4

Eh yung mga ibang tao

42:42.4

Pwede pong magpunta

42:43.4

At anghinin yun

42:44.4

42:45.4

At pag hindi po natin

42:46.4

Napaalis yun

42:47.4

Over a period of time

42:49.4

Magiging kanila po yun

42:51.4

Ah talaga

42:52.4

Opo

42:53.4

Parang squatting

42:54.4

Parang professional squatting

42:55.4

Parang ganito po sa batas

42:56.4

It's not exactly the same

42:58.4

But by analogy

42:59.4

Just so that we have

43:01.4

Diba po sa atin

43:02.4

Domestically speaking

43:05.4

Pagka may lupa ka

43:07.4

Nagbabayad ka ng amilyar

43:09.4

Etc

43:10.4

Alam natin na iyan

43:11.4

Pero pag hindi mo napupuntahan

43:13.4

Hindi pinabayaan mo

43:15.4

May pumunta po doon

43:16.4

Pumunta po doon

43:18.4

Nagtayo ng kubo

43:20.4

Over a period of time

43:21.4

Depende po

43:22.4

Kung builders on good faith

43:24.4

Pagka builders on bad faith

43:26.4

Alam nila na hindi kanila yan

43:27.4

After 30 years

43:29.4

Nagiging kanila

43:30.4

Ito po yung tinatawag nating

43:31.4

Prescription

43:33.4

Under international po

43:35.4

Pag pinabayaan natin

43:36.4

Maging ganon

43:37.4

Pwede po yung mag mature

43:38.4

Into what we call

43:39.4

Effective jurisdiction

43:41.4

Ang pwede pong gamitin

43:42.4

Nung kabilang bansa

43:44.4

Ah meron kaming effective jurisdiction

43:45.4

Diyan

43:47.4

For so many years

43:48.4

And

43:49.4

Idedemonstrate nila

43:50.4

Ito yung mga

43:51.4

Acts

43:52.4

43:53.4

Jurisdiction

43:54.4

That we have been doing

43:55.4

That's why

43:56.4

Pag bumayag tayo

43:57.4

At na humingi ng permiso sa kanila

43:59.4

O magkaroon ng

44:00.4

44:01.4

Quote unquote

44:02.4

Gentleman's agreement

44:03.4

Na ipagpapaalam natin

44:04.4

44:05.4

44:06.4

For example

44:07.4

44:08.4

Hindi kami maglalagay ng

44:09.4

Maglalagay ng

44:10.4

Construction materials

44:11.4

Diyan

44:12.4

Those are

44:13.4

Acts of ownership

44:14.4

Of ownership

44:15.4

On their part

44:16.4

So they are evidence

44:18.4

To indicate

44:19.4

That they are exercising

44:21.4

Effective jurisdiction

44:22.4

Ayan no

44:23.4

Epektibo yung jurisdiction namin

44:24.4

Kasi humihingi sila sa amin

44:25.4

Ng permiso

44:26.4

Mmm

44:27.4

Kasi nagko commit sila

44:28.4

Na hindi sila magko contract

44:29.4

What does that mean

44:30.4

Recognition on our part

44:32.4

That somehow

44:33.4

They have a right

44:34.4

Over that property

44:35.4

Paano pinapamigay natin

44:36.4

Ganon po ang kalalabasan yan

44:37.4

30 years from now

44:39.4

And that's why

44:40.4

This generation of filipinos

44:42.4

And policymakers

44:44.4

Must be aware

44:45.4

Of what they are doing now

44:47.4

Because whatever we do now

44:49.4

Will have implications

44:50.4

In the future

44:51.4

In terms of

44:53.4

Control over that area

44:55.4

Bibigyan ko po kayo na isang example

44:57.4

Na related dito

44:58.4

Kanina po sinasabi nila

45:00.4

Di ba

45:01.4

1990 daw nag-commit

45:02.4

You see how China is doing it

45:03.4

So sinabi niya na nag-commit ha

45:05.4

Eh what else now

45:06.4

30 years

45:07.4

Pag nagkaroon tayo ng gano'ng agreement

45:09.4

At pumayag tayo na humihingi ng permiso

45:11.4

Eh di 30 years from now

45:13.4

Or 20 years from now

45:14.4

Sasabihin niya sa mga batang Pilipino

45:17.4

Na ngayon

45:18.4

Eh namumuli sa bahay

45:20.4

Oh yung inyong 30 years ago

45:22.4

Yung inyong

45:23.4

Yung inyong gobyerno

45:25.4

Yung inyong mga leader

45:26.4

Eto yung commitment nila

45:28.4

Commitment nila

45:29.4

Hindi maglalagay ng

45:30.4

Ng mga construction materials

45:32.4

45:33.4

45:34.4

Hindi

45:35.4

45:36.4

45:37.4

45:38.4

Ano lang

45:39.4

Pagkain lang ang dadal

45:40.4

Yan yung commitment to

45:41.4

In legal terms

45:42.4

You know what they

45:43.4

That means

45:44.4

That means we are recognizing their

45:46.4

Their

45:47.4

Their

45:48.4

Their authority over that area

45:50.4

So eto yung sinabi naman

45:51.4

And it can be used against us

45:53.4

And that's why you have to be careful with this

45:56.4

Eto yung mga implications

45:57.4

That's why whatever

45:59.4

Agreement or actions we are going to take in that area

46:02.4

We must always think

46:04.4

Of the future consequences

46:06.4

Because at the end of the day

46:07.4

If you notice

46:08.4

Eto yung sinasabi ko

46:10.4

For us to be able to understand

46:11.4

Yung South China Sea

46:13.4

We have to expand the timeline

46:16.4

In understanding the pattern of behavior

46:20.4

So for those people who are saying

46:22.4

Nawalang negosyasyon

46:24.4

Think back

46:25.4

Look back

46:26.4

See what happened

46:27.4

We actually negotiated

46:29.4

And we tried

46:30.4

In all sincerity

46:31.4

We tried to settle

46:32.4

But what has happened is

46:34.4

They keep on changing the status quo

46:36.4

Kaya ang status ko na yan

46:37.4

You have to be very careful about

46:39.4

The use of the word

46:40.4

Because anong status ko

46:41.4

Ang pinag-uusapan natin

46:43.4

Because if we admit

46:44.4

That the status ko now

46:46.4

That we at this time

46:48.4

And this is the status ko

46:50.4

Na okay nandiyan ng Coast Guard

46:52.4

That's wrong

46:53.4

That is not the status ko

46:55.4

That we should agree on

46:57.4

O yung status ko na hindi kami magdadala ng

47:00.4

Nang construction

47:02.4

That is not the status ko

47:05.4

That is in our favor

47:07.4

And so we have to be very careful about that

47:10.4

Sa mischief rate naman

47:11.4

Dahil cannot be considered ambassador

47:13.4

As effective jurisdiction by China

47:16.4

Dahil nagtayo siya yung installations na

47:19.4

Yun yung value ng ating arbitration

47:22.4

And that's one of the reason

47:23.4

Why we filed arbitration

47:25.4

Because kung hindi tayo nagkaroon ng arbitration

47:28.4

Yung kanilang de facto possession

47:31.4

Or de facto occupation

47:33.4

Later on

47:34.4

Over a period of time

47:36.4

Can mature into a de jure

47:39.4

Possession or ownership

47:41.4

Using the modality of effective jurisdiction

47:46.4

And that was one of the reason

47:48.4

We filed arbitration

47:50.4

Because now dahil meron ng arbitration

47:52.4

May klarong decision yung tribunal

47:56.4

Na part siya ng continental shelf

48:00.4

And part siya ng exclusive continental shelf

48:03.4

To be more specific ng Pilipinas

48:06.4

So sa madaling salita po

48:08.4

Ang China dapat mag-isip ng

48:11.4

Umalis sa mischief rate

48:13.4

So ito po yung importance nung

48:16.4

Consistent na pagka-file natin ng diplomatic protest

48:19.4

Exactly

48:20.4

Yung pagka-file ng protest po

48:22.4

Meron po yung value legally and politically

48:26.4

And part of an overall strategy

48:29.4

Ang value po niya legally

48:31.4

Of course you are showing and demonstrating

48:34.4

That we never acquiesced to your claim

48:37.4

Some people are trying to reduce

48:39.4

The entire discussion

48:41.4

Into something like this

48:43.4

If you stand up for your rights

48:45.4

You are for war

48:47.4

And then pagka

48:49.4

You are for peace

48:50.4

Pagka pinayagan mo sila

48:52.4

Nagawin yung ginagawa nila

48:54.4

O yung parang mag-agree lang tayo

48:57.4

I think that's wrong

48:58.4

That narrative should be corrected

49:00.4

Because that's not how it is

49:02.4

We have a right

49:04.4

And it is our obligation

49:05.4

To stand up

49:06.4

For our right

49:07.4

Standing up for our right

49:09.4

Does not mean creating war

49:11.4

These are two different concepts

49:14.4

And it is obligatory

49:16.4

And it is just right

49:18.4

For any country

49:19.4

For any government

49:21.4

Na tumayo sa karapatan natin

49:23.4

Because if we don't do that

49:25.4

Who will?

49:26.4

And does that mean we are for war?

49:28.4

49:29.4

It is

49:30.4

This is what we call now

49:33.4

Ito yung fear that they are trying to instill on us

49:36.4

Obviously that's oversimplification

49:39.4

And it's not true

49:42.4

Sana po ang ating pagtayo sa ating karapatan

49:47.4

Sa South China Sea

49:50.4

Eh hindi lang po ito burden ng Pangulo ng Pilipinas

49:54.4

This is a shared burden by all Filipinos po

49:59.4

In fact, including the international community

50:02.4

Because the implications is not just for the Philippines

50:05.4

It's not just for regional peace

50:07.4

But on a global basis

50:09.4

And so we have to do our part

50:12.4

And part of doing our part

50:14.4

Is to learn

50:15.4

To understand

50:17.4

To research

50:19.4

So that we know all the issues

50:21.4

And whenever

50:23.4

And when the time comes that we have so much information

50:26.4

And we learn

50:27.4

We will be able to do what is right

50:30.4

In terms of helping the government

50:33.4

Helping the president

50:34.4

Carry the burden

50:36.4

Of protecting what is ours

50:39.4

At dyan po nagtatapos yung ating Facts First Convo ngayong araw

50:42.4

Maraming maraming salamat po sa pananood

50:44.4

At tulad po nang sinabi ni Ambassador Henry Bensurto

50:47.4

Eh sana mas pag-aralan pa po natin yung issue

50:50.4

Dapat mas maunawaan po natin yung mga issues na

50:53.4

Nakadikit po dyan sa West Philippine Sea

50:56.4

Dahil napakalinoon mo naman po talaga

50:58.4

Kung sino po'y nangi-encroach

50:59.4

At kung sino po'y may tunay na karapatan

51:02.4

Dyan po sa ating bakuran

51:03.4

Again ako po si Christian Esguerra

51:05.4

Maraming maraming salamat po

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